'15 MD OT Pat Allen

#927
#927
Tux said:
You did not read what was said, now did you?

If you had, you would know that you are barking up the wrong tree and not even discussing what was being said.

The positions that they recruit are irrelevant, but it is the position coaches who carry the lead role in almost all cases.
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You might want to check what I just posted about this and the sources. No the position coach is not the lead role in almost all cases.
 
#929
#929
titansvolsfaninga said:
Well we will see next year, in 15 then. I am working under the premise that these young men would get two years in S&C before being called into service. But I forgot most on VN expects every freshman to come in and start right away. I think Ray and Colemen will be good.
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I absolutely don't expect Fr to come in and play or start right away. The ideal is for linemen especially to develop for at least a year before making a contribution.

I was answering very narrowly a very broad declaration. It should not take until '16 to know whether this staff can recruit and develop OL's.

Agree with you. We should see some serious signs of improvement in '15. Not necessarily "dominance"... but something MUCH better than this year in all phases of play.

The idea that guys play poorly for 2 to 4 years then in year 4 of a coaching staff suddenly become good players... isn't realistic.

We should see incremental improvement. Spring to fall. August to December. December to spring. Spring to fall.


I think they've signed several guys with great potential. Like you posted, personnel decisions at this point are a little mystifying. You have to wonder a little where a guy like Sanders is in all this. He was a Rivals 250 player that hasn't been able to get on the field at a position of tremendous need.
 
#930
#930
volnpowell said:
How an OL recruit views the OL coach is still important even if not "the lead recruiter" though.
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Absolutely, that's why mahoney appears to be the secondary coach for most of these O-lineman we're target. But the coach who's responsible for establishing that relationship and keeping constant contact is based on the the territory their assigned to.
 
#931
#931
AstonRoyal said:
You might want to check what I just posted about this and the sources. No the position coach is not the lead role in almost all cases.
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The other poster was arguing something about position coaches only recruiting their position. I never once made any statement regarding that other than stating that is not the case.

My point is that most head coaches are not the lead the lead recruiter in most cases and that the assistant coaches are usually the lead recruiter for most prospects.
 
#932
#932
It's a staff effort to recruit kids. Coach G has ties in SC. Thig has ties in NC/AL/GA. Willie has ties throughout the SE region. Elder has been making ties in NC, and he has ties in OH. Coach Z has ties in FL/GA/up North. Etc, etc, etc....

However, it's important that your position coach knows how to seal the deal. Thig may talk to Allen all the time, but at the end of the day, Mahoney has to seal the deal. He's Allen's position coach. The relationship between the prospect and the position coach is vital when trying to obtain a player. Thig can bait the hook, hook the fish, and begin to reel the big fish in, but at some point, someone, aka the position coach, is going to have to help him place the fish in the boat.
 
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#933
#933
sjt18 said:
Not being a smart aleck but the biggest reason credit isn't given for Robertson is that the overall performance was so poor.

Agree with you on Kerbyson. Poor guy. He tried. He would probably make a great RG. He just doesn't seem to have the physical attributes to play LT.

Also agree on Kendrick.

Did you hear "discipline" or "disciplinary"? HUGE difference. Discipline issues would mean something football related most likely. You're right. It would seem that if he had some big off the field issue that it would have been reported.

I could imagine a scenario where he made too many mental and physical mistakes in practice. Jones seems to value execution and avoiding mistakes over "athletic ability" in instances like that. That's a philosophy that in time may bear great dividends.... but Fulmer would have played Kendrick IMO. Just different ideas about how to win games.
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Swain made it sound like there were some off the field things going on that kept Kendrick off the field. I hope he gets it together.
 
#934
#934
Tux said:
The position coaches are the lead recruiter in 90% of all recruits. Butch is one of the few coaches who works as a lead recruiter.
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Position coaches are obviously involved in recruiting their position but the lead varies. Josh Malone's lead recruiter was Thigpen (LB) as was Robertson (remember Jashon was a late steal from Vandy when the snake oil salesman bolted to Penn State Pen), Barnett was Thigpen and Elder, but Thigpen got Dillon Bates, so it's a mix. 90% position coach may be high but they are involved. Thigpen seems to be in on a lot of the higher touted recruits, and I agree Butch is hands-on plus a good closer. But the point that coaches are assigned geographic areas is correct.
 
#935
#935
Tux said:
The other poster was arguing something about position coaches only recruiting their position. I never once made any statement regarding that other than stating that is not the case.

My point is that most head coaches are not the lead the lead recruiter in most cases and that the assistant coaches are usually the lead recruiter for most prospects.
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Ah thanks for clearing that up, apologies. Although I will say that while Butch isn't the "lead" per se, he does seem more involved directly with the recruits. Probably has enough of a relationship with them to where he doesn't have to write notes in the palm of his hand like a certain Georgia coach.
 
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#936
#936
This is the most important recruiting battle this staff has faced at UT. All the 5* RBs and WRs in the world are useless if opposing DEs can camp out in your backfield because you have no quality OT play.
 
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#937
#937
Tux said:
The other poster was arguing something about position coaches only recruiting their position. I never once made any statement regarding that other than stating that is not the case.

My point is that most head coaches are not the lead the lead recruiter in most cases and that the assistant coaches are usually the lead recruiter for most prospects.
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I am confused. Your original post said that 90% of the time, the position coach is the lead recruiter. Now, you say that's not true and that's not what you said. Different Tux?
 
#939
#939
VolGee4 said:
I am confused. Your original post said that 90% of the time, the position coach is the lead recruiter. Now, you say that's not true and that's not what you said. Different Tux?
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The position coaches are the lead recruiters in most cases. That means assistant coaches.
 
#942
#942
SGMVols said:
This is the most important recruiting battle this staff has faced at UT. All the 5* RBs and WRs in the world are useless if opposing DEs can camp out in your backfield because you have no quality OT play.
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Yet Jones is rated higher than this guy. Perhaps Jones was the most important recruiting battle.
 
#943
#943
VolGee4 said:
Not necessarily. That was the discussion. Elder was the lead recruiter for Tuttle, and he isn't the position coach.
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It's based on geography in most cases. Each coach is responsibile for a certain geographic region.
 
#944
#944
scvolfan7 said:
Swain made it sound like there were some off the field things going on that kept Kendrick off the field. I hope he gets it together.
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Thanks. I hadn't seen that and definitely hope it isn't true... or if it is that it doesn't continue.
 
#946
#946
The organization of a recruiting effort is important. You ALWAYS want multiple coaches involved in case a coach leaves.

That said, the single most important guy on the staff in recruiting is always the HC. Kids know that position coaches and coordinators change often. If they believe in the HC then they'll trust him to hire quality asst's.
 
#948
#948
DaddyChad said:
This but good luck getting Tux to believe that.
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If I were a recruit, I think my decision would hinge more on who my position coach was than who my primary recruiter was. Maybe that's what he means? The primary coach that determines a decision (other than HC) is the position coach?
 
#949
#949
jave36 said:
If I were a recruit, I think my decision would hinge more on who my position coach was than who my primary recruiter was. Maybe that's what he means? The primary coach that determines a decision (other than HC) is the position coach?
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Position coaches are involved in the recruitment but a lot of the initial legwork is done by those assigned regionally. It just has to be that way or you burn your recruiters out with so many miles on them. Thig is sort of the high priority target guy and he gets just beat up with as much miles as he gets put on him. Makes no sense to send two different position coaches early on to the same region.
 
#950
#950
sjt18 said:
That said, the single most important guy on the staff in recruiting is always the HC. Kids know that position coaches and coordinators change often. If they believe in the HC then they'll trust him to hire quality asst's.
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Except in Georgia's case! Their new offensive line coach will suck! Don't trust Richt!


Pat, listen to me.
 
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