'15 MD OT Pat Allen

[VOLorNuttin]

You people realize that thr assistant coaches are assigned geographical areas to recruit and that they don't just recruit the positions they coach right? The reality is that the position coaches don't have as much contact with recruits that they'd be directly coaching, compared to the main recruiter who's responsible for that specific player's area. So this isn't just a Mahoney "issue."

You are full of sh!ite if you think position coaches aren't the lead recruiters for their positions. Sure other coaches have some part to play. We all know that. But you better believe Azzani, for example is the main guy shopping for groceries when it comes to WR recruiting.

If he wants Jefferson more than Ryan Newsome, for example, guess which recruit gets more attention? Huh? You were saying what exactly, now?

 

[k-sny-vol]

I feel really good about getting allen now with the changes going on at UGA

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

It's always easy to blame the previous staff. Truth is, Mahoney has had 2 full classes prior to this to bring in SEC level talent. And not a single one of his recruits has shown promise of panning out.

I don't count Jashon Robertson as one of Mahoney's OL recruits, either. He was recruited for the DL, and moved over because of the lack of talent. Very telling. In fact, we're going to have to move Charles Mosley over to the OL because Mahoney whiffed at recruiting his 1st 2 classes.

Mosley would have been a beast at DT. If Mahoney had done his job as a recruiter, we wouldn't have to make that move. Can't blame that on Dooley...although he certainly didn't help any by not signing any OL in the 2012 class.

Mahoney knew the situation coming in, and knew he'd have the whole OL leaving after the 2013 season. His job at recruiting should have reflected that urgency. It didn't.

OL is position that requires development. Rarely do freshmen come in and dominate. So yes, it can be traced back to the previous administration. Unfortunately we can't judge his recruiting prowess until 16.

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

You are full of sh!ite if you think position coaches aren't the lead recruiters for their positions. Sure other coaches have some part to play. We all know that. But you better believe Azzani, for example is the main guy shopping for groceries when it comes to WR recruiting.

If he wants Jefferson more than Ryan Newsome, for example, guess which recruit gets more attention? Huh? You were saying what exactly, now?

Position coaches are normally the secondary recruiters. You are right and wrong. So you 're full of sh!te as well.

 

[Tux]

Position coaches are normally the secondary recruiters. You are right and wrong. So you 're full of sh!te as well.

Position coaches are actually the initial recruiters and often the lead recruiters.

Head coaches are usually the guy who comes in and reels them after they have been hooked by the lead recruiter.

 

[govols09]

Most important recruit left on the board

 

[PowerWookie]

Any news on allen

 

[MADISONGAVOL]

My UGA brother in law is wigging over their whole fiasco going down.

I'm near Athens a and there's a lot of unrest in Athens rt now. Its a power struggle supposedly with rich not getting support and money to get elite coaches back in Athens after recent departure of coaches. Vol fans know all about that see Fulmer later years. If true it won't end well for dawgs. I thought they should made a run on nussemier who went to Florida

 

[sjt18]

OL is position that requires development. Rarely do freshmen come in and dominate. So yes, it can be traced back to the previous administration. Unfortunately we can't judge his recruiting prowess until 16.

Kiffin in his second recruiting year bagged James and Fulton. Dooley (actually Chaney most likely) added Stone. IIRC, all 3 started games as Fr. All were full time starters as Sophs. He then signed Kerbyson, Jackson, and Tiny in '11.

Obviously '12 was a complete flop as was 2009 under Kiffin/Fulmer.

However we can say that in the 1st two years of Dooley someone was able to pull some pretty talented OL's. And... we knew they had talent before Dooley's 3rd year.

 

[keckjm]

We currently have 3 4* OL committed and have the possibility of signing 1-2 more. I think our OL this year can be traced back to the previous administration

We don't have one true LT prospect. I've said my peace on this matter, but St. Louis and Allen are on another level compared to Hall. Hall/Jones are probably best suited at RT/G. I'm ambivalent about Hall. If we landed Allen/St. Louis, it'd be monumental for our OL going forward.

 

[VolGee4]

It's always easy to blame the previous staff. Truth is, Mahoney has had 2 full classes prior to this to bring in SEC level talent. And not a single one of his recruits has shown promise of panning out.

I don't count Jashon Robertson as one of Mahoney's OL recruits, either. He was recruited for the DL, and moved over because of the lack of talent. Very telling. In fact, we're going to have to move Charles Mosley over to the OL because Mahoney whiffed at recruiting his 1st 2 classes.

Mosley would have been a beast at DT. If Mahoney had done his job as a recruiter, we wouldn't have to make that move. Can't blame that on Dooley...although he certainly didn't help any by not signing any OL in the 2012 class.

Mahoney knew the situation coming in, and knew he'd have the whole OL leaving after the 2013 season. His job at recruiting should have reflected that urgency. It didn't.

This is the VN way. No one gets credit for Robertson because someone thinks he was privy to the discussion that he was recruited only as a defensive lineman. Then, speculate that Mosley would be elite on the DL. Only here.

The main recruiters are not cut and dry either. I believe Elder had the most to do with recruiting Tuttle, and he isn't his position coach. There are other regions where coaches have influence, like Gillespie in the Atlanta area. Just not simply that all players are recruited by their position coaches.

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

Kiffin in his second recruiting year bagged James and Fulton. Dooley (actually Chaney most likely) added Stone. IIRC, all 3 started games as Fr. All were full time starters as Sophs. He then signed Kerbyson, Jackson, and Tiny in '11.

Obviously '12 was a complete flop as was 2009 under Kiffin/Fulmer.

However we can say that in the 1st two years of Dooley someone was able to pull some pretty talented OL's. And... we knew they had talent before Dooley's 3rd year.

Well we will see next year, in 15 then. I am working under the premise that these young men would get two years in S&C before being called into service. But I forgot most on VN expects every freshman to come in and start right away. I think Ray and Colemen will be good.

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

Position coaches are actually the initial recruiters and often the lead recruiters.

Head coaches are usually the guy who comes in and reels them after they have been hooked by the lead recruiter.

Not always true.

 

[volatil]

We don't have one true LT prospect. I've said my peace on this matter, but St. Louis and Allen are on another level compared to Hall. Hall/Jones are probably best suited at RT/G. I'm ambivalent about Hall. If we landed Allen/St. Louis, it'd be monumental for our OL going forward.

Landing one of these guys helps tremendously. Land both and we are back in a hurry.

 

[titansvolsfaninga]

We don't have one true LT prospect. I've said my peace on this matter, but St. Louis and Allen are on another level compared to Hall. Hall/Jones are probably best suited at RT/G. I'm ambivalent about Hall. If we landed Allen/St. Louis, it'd be monumental for our OL going forward.

You must have a short memory. Orlando Brown Jr was recruited for LT along with Blair. Unfortunately he didn't qualify. The decision was made to RS Blair for stop gap. The coaches went all in on DR and that back fired. That's a lesson learned with Memphis recruiting. UT will be ok. CBJ plays chess, not checkers.

 

[Tux]

Not always true.

The position coaches are the lead recruiter in 90% of all recruits. Butch is one of the few coaches who works as a lead recruiter.

 

[buffaloblue]

Land both and this is a more succesful class then 2014. Sounds insane but I think it closes final major gaps which allows you to compete at highest level rather then just compete.

 

[scvolfan7]

Kiffin in his second recruiting year bagged James and Fulton. Dooley (actually Chaney most likely) added Stone. IIRC, all 3 started games as Fr. All were full time starters as Sophs. He then signed Kerbyson, Jackson, and Tiny in '11.

Obviously '12 was a complete flop as was 2009 under Kiffin/Fulmer.

However we can say that in the 1st two years of Dooley someone was able to pull some pretty talented OL's. And... we knew they had talent before Dooley's 3rd year.

Why does no one give credit to Mahoney for Jashon Robertson? Started every game, same position. IMO the problem with this line was that for some reason we kept playing kyler at LT when Kendrick should have been there the whole time. I've heard Kendrick has some disciplinary issues but they couldn't have been that bad if he wasn't kicked off the team

 

[keckjm]

You must have a short memory. Orlando Brown Jr was recruited for LT along with Blair. Unfortunately he didn't qualify. The decision was made to RS Blair for stop gap. The coaches went all in on DR and that back fired. That's a lesson learned with Memphis recruiting. UT will be ok. CBJ plays chess, not checkers.

I never said we haven't recruited a LT prospect, I said we didn't have a true LT prospect. I also was talking about this class only. I thought the Allen/St.Louis to Hall comparison was a dead give away of that.

Also, who's to blame for the "all in" recruitment of Brown when he couldn't qualify? Who's to blame when Richmond used UT after we slow played everyone for him? The circumstances for the lack of OT recruiting by this staff will soon become an unacceptable excuse for our struggles on the OL. In 2.5 years we have recruited two true OTs, Blair and Kendrick. That's not acceptable. Last time I checked, we don't obtain brownie points for our effort on the recruiting trail. I know this staff works hard; however, our OT recruiting is subpar so far. In terms of OT recruiting, we aren't playing checkers or chess, we are playing Russian Roulette with a bullet in one of the chambers. If Blair doesn't work out, and we don't obtain another OT this recruiting class, we might be in serious trouble.

 

[engineerVOL]

I'm sorry but I don't believe for one second this staff went all in for Richmond at the expense of others. And that it "backfired." They're not perfect but what leads people to believe that Butch was so naive to think DR was ours to lose that he totally stopped the pursuit of other tackle prospects. LebVol sowed that seed in your heads.

 

[AstonRoyal]

You are full of sh!ite if you think position coaches aren't the lead recruiters for their positions. Sure other coaches have some part to play. We all know that. But you better believe Azzani, for example is the main guy shopping for groceries when it comes to WR recruiting.

If he wants Jefferson more than Ryan Newsome, for example, guess which recruit gets more attention? Huh? You were saying what exactly, now?

You're making assumptions. It's mainly territorial because some coaches have more relationships in certain areas and it's more efficient to send them on trips into an area rather then them going all over the country. That's not to say that the position coach is completely out of it, but recruiting's all about relationships.

"I can't give you the exact recruiting territory of each coach, they play that a little close to the vest, but each coach is assigned a specific territory or area to cover. Once specific players are identified, sometimes the position coach also helps recruit certain players. Every coach ends up helping out, it's a complete group effort and it helps build on the family atmosphere that defines the Tennessee football culture."

Source: Inside The T Mailbag: The Barrel - UTSPORTS.COM - University of Tennessee Athletics

For example for Drew Richmond, the primary recruiter is Mark Elder and the secondary is Mahoney. So Elder will be the one that calls Richmond everyday and the one who'll have established a relationship with Richmond. That's not to say that Mahoney's not a part of it but it's not primarily in contact with him. Also it's worth noting that Butch is actually more involved directly in recruiting than coaches normally which is why he's been so successful at recruiting.
Source: Drew Richmond Recruit Interests

Another example, Thigpen's actually Allen's lead recruiter and Mahoney is secondary.
Source: Patrick Allen Recruit Interests

So no, position coaches ARE NOT the lead recruiters for their positions. So YOU were saying what exactly, now?

 

[Fullfillmer]

You're making assumptions. It's all territorial because some coaches have more relationships in certain areas and it's more efficient to send them on trips into an area rather then them going all over the country. That's not to say that the position coach is completely out of it, but recruiting's all about relationships.



Source: Inside The T Mailbag: The Barrel - UTSPORTS.COM - University of Tennessee Athletics

For example for Drew Richmond, the primary recruiter is Mark Elder and the secondary is Mahoney. So Elder will be the one that calls Richmond everyday and the one who'll have established a relationship with Richmond. That's not to say that Mahoney's not a part of it but it's not primarily in contact with him. Also it's worth noting that Butch is actually more involved directly in recruiting than coaches normally which is why he's been so successful at recruiting.
Source: Drew Richmond Recruit Interests

Another example, Thigpen's actually Allen's lead recruiter and Mahoney is secondary.
Source: Patrick Allen Recruit Interests

So no, position coaches ARE NOT the lead recruiters for their positions.

Excellent - I have heard that this Thig has been known to Thig.

 

[OrangeHammer]

The position coaches are the lead recruiter in 90% of all recruits. Butch is one of the few coaches who works as a lead recruiter.

This is not true at all, very far from it. The coaches recruit the areas, and their position has nothing to do with it. Maybe 10% of the time the actual position coach swoops in to help but coaches recruit areas yet are familiar with.

 

[sjt18]

Why does no one give credit to Mahoney for Jashon Robertson? Started every game, same position. IMO the problem with this line was that for some reason we kept playing kyler at LT when Kendrick should have been there the whole time. I've heard Kendrick has some disciplinary issues but they couldn't have been that bad if he wasn't kicked off the team

Not being a smart aleck but the biggest reason credit isn't given for Robertson is that the overall performance was so poor.

Agree with you on Kerbyson. Poor guy. He tried. He would probably make a great RG. He just doesn't seem to have the physical attributes to play LT.

Also agree on Kendrick.

Did you hear "discipline" or "disciplinary"? HUGE difference. Discipline issues would mean something football related most likely. You're right. It would seem that if he had some big off the field issue that it would have been reported.

I could imagine a scenario where he made too many mental and physical mistakes in practice. Jones seems to value execution and avoiding mistakes over "athletic ability" in instances like that. That's a philosophy that in time may bear great dividends.... but Fulmer would have played Kendrick IMO. Just different ideas about how to win games.

 

[Tux]

This is not true at all, very far from it. The coaches recruit the areas, and their position has nothing to do with it. Maybe 10% of the time the actual position coach swoops in to help but coaches recruit areas yet are familiar with.

You did not read what was said, now did you?

If you had, you would know that you are barking up the wrong tree and not even discussing what was being said.

The positions that they recruit are irrelevant, but it is the position coaches who carry the lead role in almost all cases.