Limitations of a "West Coast" Offense

#1
TNinOR

TNinOR

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#1
Sure, speed kills. I think we, as Vol fans, have bought into that by now, because that is the type of team Butch Jones is building. But the SEC has nevertheless been more successful than other conferences, including and especially the PAC-10 (or whatever it's called now), because it attacks and dominates at the line of scrimmage (and, yes, to do that successfully requires a healthy dose of speed in its own right).

Now that we have adopted a "West Coast" style, I just hope that Coach Butch Jones doesn't lose sight of what made and continues to make the SEC successful.

Ultimately, I think we can do both: Run a spread offense and still hunker down and smash some mouths when we need to.

I am elated to have heard CBJ acknowledge on several occasions that the SEC is a "line of scrimmage" league, and I hope that signifies that, as much as he loves speed and "spreading it out", he understands that this style of football, in and of itself, does have its limitations on occasion.

For example, Stanford consistently owns Oregon. Why? Because they have made it a policy to take it to Oregon, defensively, by being very physical at the line of scrimmage and knocking Oregon off its game. Similarly, as flashy as Oregon is, it has not yet broken through to a national championship because it has inevitably run into SEC teams that have done the same thing.

It's all well and good to spread 'em out and dazzle them with your speed, but there come times when the other guy either has your number and/or things are just not clicking on your end. When those times come, you just have to be able to line up and smash 'em into submission (like we did against Arkansas in '98, for example). I think, I hope, that is exactly why CBJ has been recruiting guys like Hurd, Weatherd, Bates, TK, etc. The future sure does seem bright!
 
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#2
#2
Limitations of a West Coast offense: none. Signed, Joe Montana, Steve Young, Jerry Rice, Bill Walsh, Mike Holmgren, Tom Brady, and Bill Belichek.
 
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#3
#3
Keep in mind that West coast offense is not run n shoot or even fun n gun. I seem to recall Roger Craig and the FB Rathman having a lot of say in all those San Francisco 49 games. Bill Walsh was the architect of the quote "west coast offense".
 
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#4
#4
TNinOR said:
For example, Stanford consistently owns Oregon. Why? Because they have made it a policy to take it to Oregon, defensively, by being very physical at the line of scrimmage and knocking Oregon off its game. Similarly, as flashy as Oregon is, it has not yet broken through to a national championship because it has inevitably run into SEC teams that have done the same thing.
Click to expand...

Oregon went to the 2010 National Championship Game versus Auburn.
 
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#5
#5
wolfej said:
Oregon went to the 2010 National Championship Game versus Auburn.
Click to expand...

I said they haven't broken through and WON a national championship, not that they haven't played for one. Auburn dominated at the line of scrimmage and kept them from it. That's my point.
 
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#6
#6
Those Meyer era Florida teams were pretty successful spreading the field. Was it 2 BCS titles? *shivers*
 
#7
#7
TNinOR said:
Sure, speed kills. I think we, as Vol fans, have bought into that by now, because that is the type of team Butch Jones is building. But the SEC has nevertheless been more successful than other conferences, including and especially the PAC-10 (or whatever it's called now), because it attacks and dominates at the line of scrimmage (and, yes, to do that successfully requires a healthy dose of speed in its own right).

Now that we have adopted a "West Coast" style, I just hope that Coach Butch Jones doesn't lose sight of what made and continues to make the SEC successful.

Ultimately, I think we can do both: Run a spread offense and still hunker down and smash some mouths when we need to.

I am elated to have heard CBJ acknowledge on several occasions that the SEC is a "line of scrimmage" league, and I hope that signifies that, as much as he loves speed and "spreading it out", he understands that this style of football, in and of itself, does have its limitations on occasion.

For example, Stanford consistently owns Oregon. Why? Because they have made it a policy to take it to Oregon, defensively, by being very physical at the line of scrimmage and knocking Oregon off its game. Similarly, as flashy as Oregon is, it has not yet broken through to a national championship because it has inevitably run into SEC teams that have done the same thing.

It's all well and good to spread 'em out and dazzle them with your speed, but there come times when the other guy either has your number and/or things are just not clicking on your end. When those times come, you just have to be able to line up and smash 'em into submission (like we did against Arkansas in '98, for example). I think, I hope, that is exactly why CBJ has been recruiting guys like Hurd, Weatherd, Bates, TK, etc. The future sure does seem bright!
Click to expand...

You do know Kiffin runs a West coast offense right? We were pretty good at running the ball that yr. All west coast really means is u run a lot of crossing routes and u run stretch and zone
 
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#9
#9
So let me get this straight.......we run a "west coast" offense now? Ughhhhhhh................... I dont think so.
 
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#10
#10
I didn't think Oregon ran a west coast offense anyway. I thought a west coast offense was based on short to intermediate passing routes with stretch and zone running plays.

OP may have confused a "west coast offense" for any of those spread offenses run literally on the west coast. Apologies if I'm mistaken.
 
#14
#14
Why do people (especially fans in the SEC) make fun of Oregon's offense?

I have never understood the idea of pointing out one of the most dominant offenses of the decade. And usually the "can't win a NCAA title comes up". How many titles has Washington or Stanford or UCLA or OU or Michigan or Clemson or Miami or Georgia or Nebraska or Tennessee won during the last decade. No offense, but this line of reasoning is pathetically illogical.

I can think of about a million things I'd rather worry about than having Oregon like offensive results.
 
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#15
#15
TNinOR said:
I said they haven't broken through and WON a national championship, not that they haven't played for one. Auburn dominated at the line of scrimmage and kept them from it. That's my point.
Click to expand...

Outcome was in doubt til the end...not exactly a shutdown? :huh:
 
#16
#16
I think you have the definition of the "west coast" offense wrong. Just because a team is on the west coast of the United States doesn't mean they run the west coast offense. A west coast offense is generally thought of as a pro style, 2 back system that uses power runs and quick passes. The team you credited, Stanford, actually runs a system that is heavily rooted in the west coast offense.

That being said, Oregon is among the most physical teams in the country at the line of scrimmage. Just because you line up in the shotgun doesn't mean you can't be physical. Their offensive system is fundamentally sound.

Everything our coaching staff has done since their arrival indicates to me that we will be a team who strives to run the ball and be very physical up front.
 
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#17
#17
roosterjbh said:
I believe our passing routes are based on a lot of west coast principles.
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just because we have some shorter routes in our system doesnt make us a west coast offense. We are a spread offense... or as Butch Jones said "we run a power spread".
 
#18
#18
KingtUT said:
just because we have some shorter routes in our system doesnt make us a west coast offense. We are a spread offense... or as Butch Jones said "we run a power spread".
Click to expand...

I agree with you that we run a spread offense, just saying there are similarities in the passing tree.
 
#19
#19
West Coast offense will be good for Jalen, he has the possibility to see time at H-back, Tight End, and Left Tackle if he can get his pad leverage a little bit lower. What is he listed at now? 6'9" ?
 
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#21
#21
livefaith said:
Why do people (especially fans in the SEC) make fun of Oregon's offense?

I have never understood the idea of pointing out one of the most dominant offenses of the decade. And usually the "can't win a NCAA title comes up". How many titles has Washington or Stanford or UCLA or OU or Michigan or Clemson or Miami or Georgia or Nebraska or Tennessee won during the last decade. No offense, but this line of reasoning is pathetically illogical.

I can think of about a million things I'd rather worry about than having Oregon like offensive results.
Click to expand...

No question that oregons offense has had a lot of success. I think you could compare it to the Loyola marrimount basketball experiment. Why don't anyone run that anymore in basketball? Oregon has a gimmick offense. They try to spread you out with several options, using motions, etc, hoping to get defenses to line up wrong by running plays quickly and often. They try to gas out the defenses and not allow substitutions. I personally am glad that all teams don't run that style, it would get old to me quick. Defenses are starting to catch up to the style I think. Most are not there yet, but Stanford has given everyone the blue print. Keep in mind though, Oregon could run a lot of styles of offense that would have been successful the last few years. They have seen a lot of high calibre players the last few years.
 
#22
#22
This thread was doomed to fail from the very beginning. OP doesn't seem to understand the difference between "west coast offense" and the spread/ read option. Not the same. West coast offense was basically short to intermediate horizontal routes that were used in order to open up the defense for longer runs and the vertical passing game
 
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#23
#23
volstopfan14 said:
I think you have the definition of the "west coast" offense wrong. Just because a team is on the west coast of the United States doesn't mean they run the west coast offense. A west coast offense is generally thought of as a pro style, 2 back system that uses power runs and quick passes. The team you credited, Stanford, actually runs a system that is heavily rooted in the west coast offense.

That being said, Oregon is among the most physical teams in the country at the line of scrimmage. Just because you line up in the shotgun doesn't mean you can't be physical. Their offensive system is fundamentally sound.

Everything our coaching staff has done since their arrival indicates to me that we will be a team who strives to run the ball and be very physical up front.
Click to expand...

You don't need a fullback or an H-back to run the west coast. The west coast is mainly a short-intermediate passing game that sets up the deep pass. Everybody in the country has to run the ball, or they'd be predictable.

Oregon lost to Stanford, not because of an offensive flaw, because they kept making mistakes like fumbles and interceptions. A team like Stanford will capitalize on it and shove it down their throat.

If we make less mistakes than the other team, we will win.
 
#24
#24
Okay, I stand corrected, "West Coast offense" wasn't the most precise terminology. I am thinking of the spread offense that roddo518 above describes as:

"They try to spread you out with several options, using motions, etc, hoping to get defenses to line up wrong by running plays quickly and often. They try to gas out the defenses and not allow substitutions. . . . Defenses are starting to catch up to the style I think. Most are not there yet, but Stanford has given everyone the blue print."

My point is that using speed to "try and gas out the defenses and not allowing substitutions" is not an unbeatable offensive strategy. Ultimately, whatever scheme is used, long term success will always depend upon a combination of speed and power, but the most important factor in that, imo, is being dominant at the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball. The SEC has been successful with that for years. Why change a winning formula? And by that, I am not saying that we shouldn't run a spread offense or install other schemes, but that we should always try to maintain the ability to just line it up and ram it down your throat when all else fails. And with the backs we have started recruiting, Hurd in particular, we should be able to do that if we need to.
 
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