Spring Meetings

[volnpowell]

Anything interesting mentioned yet? I did not get to hear what Jimmy Hyams said. I figured Jimmy is not good for most info, but he should be able to relay what was told at meeting.

 

[TrueOrange]

Lots of talk about scheduling and the attendance problem; apparently Saban went off heavily about moving towards a 9-conference-game format

Pat Forde ‏@YahooForde 6h
At SEC spring meetings. Nick Saban just brought the thunder in support of a nine-game league schedule.

Andy Staples ‏@Andy_Staples 7h
Nick Saban breaks ranks with his coaching brethren and says he’s in favor of 9 conference games.

And also, here's some quotes regarding Butch Jones:

Quote of day: UT coach Butch Jones on ball protection: "The football is the key to all of your hopes and dreams.Why would you let go of it?"

Another Butch Jones gem: "Praise and blame -- it's all the same."

 

[WoodstockVol]

Probably debating 8-9 game Conference schedules. I'd rather see 8 game schedule. I like seeing non SEC opponents from time to time.

 

[TrueOrange]

Few articles came up also regarding everything Saban said, he seems to have been the main event; he apparently also went on a long rant about how they should be making their decisions "thinking of the fans" (more or less)....he also took a shot at OSU

First Pat Forde's

Y! SPORTS

DESTIN, Fla. – Nick Saban’s Southeastern Conference brethren should listen to him.

Not just because he owns them on the field in the fall. Because he’s the smartest coach in the conference room, too.

They should listen to the Alabama coach’s pitch for adding a ninth game to the league schedule. They should man up and embrace the challenge, instead of using the SEC’s legitimate power status as an excuse to schedule timidly. They should resist the lure of three or four hollow victories a year over the likes of Alabama State, Alcorn State and Southeast Missouri State and take on someone their own size.

This will be the hot topic this week at SEC spring meetings – over chilled jumbo shrimp, at the beach, on the golf course and at places where actual work may get done.

Saban made his case for nine games again Tuesday, saying “I’m absolutely in the minority, no question about it.” Most SEC coaches say it’s like volunteering to hit yourself in the head with a hammer nine times instead of eight.

“If you look at it through a straw and how it affects you and you’re self-absorbed about it, nobody’s going to be for it,” Saban said. “I shouldn’t be for it. We have a better chance to be successful if we don’t do it. But I think it’s best for the game and the league.”

Despite his minority status, Saban might have the most powerful ally in the room when the issue is raised here. Commissioner Mike Slive hasn’t come out as publicly pro or con regarding the nine-game schedule, but at the very least he sounded eager last month to engage his membership in serious debate.

Slive knows that, on the drawing board at least, strength of schedule will be a bigger part of the equation when the lyrically named College Football Playoff is implemented in 2014. And the best way to augment strength of schedule in a power league is to play more league games.

Under the tragically flawed current system, the greater goal is to go undefeated than to play the best competition possible. To that end, Saban was asked Tuesday about the possibility that Ohio State – undefeated but on NCAA probation last season – would have taken the Crimson Tide’s spot in the national title game last year.

Which gave Saban a chance to take a shot at both the current system and the Buckeyes, who played a soft 2012 schedule.

“How well would they have done if they played the six (SEC) teams ranked in the Top 10?” Saban asked. “Would they beat them all? Would they beat three of them? And I think they have a really good team and Urban (Meyer) is a great coach. I’m not questioning any of that. I’m just saying that’s where strength of schedule and who you play don’t get sort of accounted for quite equally.”

In point of fact, no SEC school played all six of those opponents in 2012. In fact, only two teams played four of the six: LSU (2-2) and Florida (3-1). Alabama played three of them and went 2-1, losing to Texas A&M.

But the point is valid. The best thing the SEC can do in a strength-of-schedule world is to play itself more often and increase its own power ratings. This already is the growing trend nationally.

The Pac-12 and Big 12 have gone to nine games. The Big Ten will do the same starting in 2016.

The SEC is scheduled to release its 2014 schedule during these meetings, and it will be an eight-game slate. But there will be an opportunity for change starting in ’15.
Saban said Tuesday he’d like to see everyone from the five major conferences play 10 games against its peers – nine in league play and one in non-conference, leaving two guaranteed home games against lightweight opponents. Schools playing a traditional non-conference rival – Florida-Florida State, South Carolina-Clemson, Georgia-Georgia Tech, Kentucky-Louisville – should not opt to drop that game in event of a nine-game league slate.

Saban pointed out that his program is scheduled through 2017 to play a heavyweight non-league opponent: Virginia Tech this year, with Wisconsin, West Virginia and Michigan State twice in years to come. And he said he’s firmly in favor of continuing the annual cross-division rivalry game with Tennessee, which he expects to rebound from its recent malaise in short order.

“They’ve got a good coach now,” Saban said of Butch Jones, which should make former Saban assistant Derrick Dooley feel three feet tall. “They’ve got great tradition. They’re going to be good again.”

The Tennessee series and the marquee non-conference opponents are fan-friendly games – and as Saban pointed out, the fans usually are the last group considered in the crass money grab that is college sports. Fans love college football so much that they’ve been willing to endure all manner of high-priced inconveniences and indignities, including a steady diet of cowardly non-conference scheduling.

But we may have reached the tipping point in that area. As the Chattanooga Times-Free Press pointed out last week and as I wrote about last year in the Forde-Yard Dash, attendance has started to decline – even at some bedrock football locales.

A primary culprit: bad games. More fans are opting to stay home and enjoy the ever-improving television experience instead of investing the time and money to watch the home team slaughter an FCS chump.

“One of these days they’re going to quit coming to games,” Saban predicted. “Everyone is going to say, ‘Why aren’t you coming to the games?’ Well, if you play somebody good, they’ll come to the games.”

That’s common sense worth listening to. Nick Saban doesn’t just coach best, he knows best about what’s good for the SEC.

MrSEC highlighted the last portion of his little "speech":

“If you look at it through a straw and how it affects you and you’re self-absorbed about it, nobody’s going to be for it. I shouldn’t be for it. We have a better chance to be successful if we don’t do it. But I think it’s best for the game and the league…

One of these days (fans are) going to quit coming to games. Everyone is going to say, ‘Why aren’t you coming to the games?’ Well, if you play somebody good, they’ll come to the games.”

 

[volnpowell]

Probably debating 8-9 game Conference schedules. I'd rather see 8 game schedule. I like seeing non SEC opponents from time to time.

While it is more entertaining to watch games that are more competitive, I think playing 9 games would just beat each other up. Even if some how you do make it to championship game, probably have more players out due to injuries. jmo.

 

[TrueOrange]

Then ESPN's SEC blog (Nick's apparently "What about the Fans?" argument today)

Nick Saban: What about the fans? - SEC Blog - ESPN

DESTIN, Fla. -- Alabama's Nick Saban knows he’s in the minority, but when has that stopped him?

Saban reiterated his support Tuesday for nine conference games in the SEC, even though his coaching brethren in the league are more than content to keep it right where it is at eight games.

Ultimately, Saban’s probably going to get his wish, at least somewhere down the road. But the 2014 and 2015 schedules the league is working to finalize this week at the SEC spring meetings are expected to be eight-game formats.

“I just think if we increase the size of the league by 15 percent, then we really need to increase the number of games,” said Saban, who’s 38-6 against all SEC opponents over the past five seasons.

“There are people who want to keep their cross-division rivalries. I think every player should have the opportunity to play every school in his career. If you don’t play two rotating games on the other side, that doesn’t happen. I really don’t think we should become a conference of just two divisions, where you just play your division and never play anybody on the other side.

“Now, there’s going to be arguments that say, ‘Well, we have to play some rivalry team in our state that makes us have another tougher game.’ Well, we’re scheduled out until 2017 with tougher games already. We play Virginia Tech, West Virginia, Wisconsin and Michigan State twice. I would really like to see everybody, not just in our conference, but everybody in the country play at least 10 games from the five major conferences.”

Saban said it’s the fans who are getting the raw end of the deal by not having more marquee games.

“The biggest thing we all need to do in some of these decisions we’re making about who we play and what we do is: What about the fans?” Saban said. “One of these days, they’re going to quit coming to the games because they’re going to stay at home and watch it on TV. Everybody’s going to say, ‘Why don’t you come to the games?’ Well, if you’d play somebody good, then we’d come to the games.

“That should be the first consideration, the fans. Nobody’s considering them. They’re just thinking about, ‘How many games can I win? Can I get bowl qualified? How many tough teams do I have to play?’ After coaching in the NFL for eight years, everybody in the NFL plays everybody in the NFL, and you lose some games. The Giants lost how many games and won the Super Bowl … six? I think it makes it more exciting if you don’t have to go undefeated or lose just one game to be able to have a chance to qualify to play for something at the end.”

The SEC has won seven straight national championships, and Alabama has won three of the past four.

So, obviously, playing just eight conference games hasn’t hurt the league. What nobody knows is how playing just eight league games will be viewed by the selection committee when the College Football Playoff goes into effect in 2014.

“If you look at it through a straw and how it affects you and you’re self-absorbed about it, then you’re not going to be for it,” Saban said. “I shouldn’t be for it. We’d have a better chance to be successful if we don’t do it, but I think it’s best for the game and for the league.

“I’m trying to look at it from 1,000 feet.”

Saban said he’s not lobbying to expand the playoff or even change the playoff in any way. He just wants to see more weight given to strength of schedule and less given to how many games you lose.

“I just think it would be better if people were talking about more teams at the end of the season rather than just two teams that might be able to get into the championship game,” Saban said. “I think what makes it healthier for college football and the fans is if they’re talking about 20 teams that have a chance to get into the Final Four ... and there aren’t going to be 20 teams undefeated.”

 

[TrueOrange]

And then Hugh Freeze came out as strongly against anything greater than an 8 game schedule:

Freeze strongly favors eight league games - SEC Blog - ESPN

One of the hot topics at this year's SEC spring meetings has to do with the number of conference games teams will play in the future.

Will the SEC go to nine league games or keep it at eight? The eight-game conference slate has certainly worked during the SEC's current seven-year BCS championship run, but with the league expanding to 14 teams last year, talk about increasing conference games has really picked up.

The creation of the new SEC Network, along with the new College Football Playoff, could also impact the number of conference games for the SEC.

One coach clearly not looking to increase the number of conference games is Ole Miss' Hugh Freeze.

"Without question, eight," Freeze said Tuesday.

Freeze was as stone-faced as possible when he delivered his answer and offered no hesitation in his voice.

He certainly isn't alone. Florida's Will Muschamp, Kentucky's Mark Stoops and Vanderbilt's James Franklin have all made it known that they prefer eight conference games. For schools that have yearly nonconference rivalry games, like Florida, Georgia, Kentucky and South Carolina, nine SEC games doesn't make sense.

Eight SEC games makes perfect sense for the Rebels. This is a program that missed a bowl for two straight seasons before Freeze arrived last year (even then the Rebels needed to win their final regular-season game to become bowl eligible). Freeze understands that his team could still hover around the six-win eligibility mark this fall because of depth issues and the simple fact that Ole Miss plays in the SEC West.

He wants as many wins as he can get, and another conference game would affect that.

It also impacts the seven losers that will inevitably come from an extra conference game.

"For me, when you add a ninth game, that's seven more losses for our conference," Freeze said. "We want to fill all of our bowl slots, we want our kids to represent our conference. When you play that extra ninth game, I know it'll probably create some more revenue, but it also is seven more losses for us."

Dollars and cents mean a lot, but so do wins and losses. So, Freeze does make a very good point, but then you have to think about the playoff and how schedule strength will impact SEC teams. People continue to talk about how adding another SEC game will only make the teams at the top stronger when it comes to selection time.

This is certainly true, but that also means that the SEC champion would have to play 10 conference games before the playoff. It also means that the SEC could flirt with not filling all of those bowl slots when it comes to teams that aren't in the top half of the league.

The SEC champ will more than likely always have a spot at the playoff table, but the league would love to get a second team a plate. An extra conference game would help that, but you have to think of the league as a whole.

That's what Freeze is saying. He wants to make sure everyone in the league is covered.

Edit: Here's also part of a second day piece regarding quotes from James Franklin, who's apparently the loudest opponent to a 9 game schedule:

While Saban has been the most vocal proponent of a nine-game conference schedule, Vanderbilt’s James Franklin has been the loudest opponent. That was true yesterday as well:



“Every coach, every administration wants the best out-of-conference schedule they possibly can have. But why should somebody else dictate to us what that is? Nobody knows what’s in the best interest of Vanderbilt, and I would argue what’s in the best interest of Vanderbilt is in the best interest of the SEC and so on and so forth…

We’ll go to nine and people will say, ‘We don’t have enough sexy out-of-conference games anymore so you’re going to have to play nine and another.’ When’s it going to stop? Two years from now they’re going to say, ‘You know, we probably ought to schedule an NFL team. You’re probably going to have to play the Jets. You’re going to have to play the Falcons.’ Now we’re going to play nine games and an NFL team. When’s it going to end?”



Amazingly that wasn’t even Franklin’s biggest spin of the day. He also suggested that an extra conference game would be bad for players’ health:



“It’s funny that we’re also talking about player welfare and health. Well, now you’re going to play another game like that a year. Couldn’t you bring up player health and safety for those games?… I think you just have to be careful that the things we’re saying are consistent.”



Now that’s a spin cycle.

For the time being, expect to see SEC teams playing an eight-game schedule in 2014 and 2015. After that, we suspect the league will move to a nine-game format. Whether the league’s teams will be forced to play the Jets or Falcons remains to be seen.

 

[volnpowell]

Thanks 4 the info Trueorange. I just think if it's not broke don't fix it. I do see what he's saying about it going more to sos, but I think it would be better to schedule a decent to slightly below avg BCS team like N.C. State rather than 9 SEC games.

 

[Stevorino]

They should go to 9 SEC games. Those who don't agree to a locked rivalry on both sides should rotate. For Example, if Alabama & Tennessee don't both agree, they rotate. This would alleviate the Florida/LSU issue but also would allow storied rivalries like UT/Bama & Auburn/GA to live on.

 

[TheDirector]

Lots of talk about scheduling and the attendance problem; apparently Saban went off heavily about moving towards a 9-conference-game format

If it replaced Austin Peay, Western Kentucky or South Alabama this year then I would be all for it.

 

[WoodstockVol]

If it replaced Austin Peay, Western Kentucky or South Alabama this year then I would be all for it.

Western Kentucky isn't all that bad. They went bowling last season and beat Kentucky. I would be for removing barely FCS teams like Austin Peay,South Alabama and UT-Chattanooga from the schedule. Teams like NCSU or Southern Miss would be nice to have on the schedule.

 

[99gator]

i don't have a problem with 9 and the reason is that there are cupcakes already within the league and people want to pretend that isn't true.

i just dealt with a home schedule last season of three cupcakes, missouri and kentucky.

the thrill of season tickets was south carolina and lsu. that's crazy.

 

[orange parmejohn]

wow did i misread that or did Saban take a verbal dookie on Dooley?

 

[JuggernaUT_VOL]

Blah blah blah I can't wait to hear helmets crackin.

 

[TrueOrange]

Thanks 4 the info Trueorange. I just think if it's not broke don't fix it. I do see what he's saying about it going more to sos, but I think it would be better to schedule a decent to slightly below avg BCS team like N.C. State rather than 9 SEC games.

I'm not sure such would eliminate BCS OOC opponents for UT though; most of those have been set up because, due to the relatively lesser amounts of talent in the home state, UT has to recruit more nationally to compensate. To do so, UT will still need to continue to establish home and homes with the bigger teams across the country to be seen in those markets/get the word around/become more noticeable to the recruits from those states...plus our AD/school is apparently one of the ones in favor of a 9 schedule anyways; the ones against it at the moment seem to be...well read the article I posted about Freeze

(Or are you saying make a "No more scheduling FCS opponents" rule like the Big Ten recently did? Or a "conference alliance" type deal?)

Either way, it's expected that no change will be coming from this year's particular meetings. However the feeling is that eventually, the conference is going to have to make that change. All the other major conferences (and even a bunch of the lesser ones) either already have 9-conference game schedule in place (the PAC-12, the Big 12) or will have one in place by 2016/2017 (the Big Ten, along with other minor ones like what's left of the new big east and some smaller ones).

Eventually, the SEC is going to have to move to such a setup as well or they're going to -more or less - be the only ones without it...in a system that's going to put a heavier burden on SOS supposedly.

(The ACC's also worth note here - thus the more or less. They were originally going to have a 9 game schedule until the Notre Dame deal went through. Now, while they're technically going to be using an 8 game conference format, 5 of the 14 teams each season will also have to play Notre Dame...so they're somewhat working with what could almost be called an 8.5ish conference game model)

 

[99gator]

i know i am in the minority on this, but a cupcake is a cupcake.

i don't see much difference in western kentucky and furman.

 

[SlipKidVol]

Probably debating 8-9 game Conference schedules. I'd rather see 8 game schedule. I like seeing non SEC opponents from time to time.

You mean like UT Martin, Western Kentucky, UTC, GA State? How about 9 conference games and only D1 opponents. Lots of MTSUs, Memphis, any MAC team, any Montain West team, any Big east team. And then one quality opponent like Oregan, UCLA, OK, Miami, Texas, OSU

 

[SlipKidVol]

i know i am in the minority on this, but a cupcake is a cupcake.

i don't see much difference in western kentucky and furman.

There's not. There are lots of MAC, USA, Montain West, Big East teams to play

 

[SlipKidVol]

Western Kentucky isn't all that bad. They went bowling last season and beat Kentucky. I would be for removing barely FCS teams like Austin Peay,South Alabama and UT-Chattanooga from the schedule. Teams like NCSU or Southern Miss would be nice to have on the schedule.

This

 

[99gator]

There's not. There are lots of MAC, USA, Montain West, Big East teams to play

well, schools like florida, alabama, etc, etc, etc, have a problem.

they used to have a bye week before rivalry week and then the ncaa went to a 12 game schedule.

well, who do you play the week before rivalry week. you don't want a tough game and the entire country has an opponent already scheduled in the 3rd week of november.

thus, the fcs opponents

 

[pualsline]

Jimmy just reported that D. Rogers has committed to the NFL draft. (confirmed)

 

[crazyguy]

I think you play 8. You're not going to get rid of the cupcakes, and playing less out of conference games doesn't give the conference as many chances to beat up on other leagues. Those OOC games against other teams matter when it comes to ranking and bowl selections. If UT, or whomever, beats up on an ACC foe at the beginning of the season- it helps the conference. I say keep 8.

And it wouldn't hurt Saban to remember that football is cyclical. If he sticks around at BAMA for long enough, and that's a big if, then he's going to have some down years. Keep your trap shut.

 

[ddubb76]

Seems conference expansion has just complicated things. Don't understand why we needed to fix something that wasn't broke.

 

[WoodstockVol]

Seems conference expansion has just complicated things. Don't understand why we needed to fix something that wasn't broke.

West Virginia would have been a better pick than Missouri Kansas State would have been better than Missouri or West Virginia and they would have taken the invitation.

 

[TrueOrange]

West Virginia would have been a better pick than Missouri Kansas State would have been better than Missouri or West Virginia and they would have taken the invitation.

No; just, no