Barnes vs Pearl

[Stoked]

I'm not talking about their head to head record because we know Pearl has the upper hand. I've been hearing that Rick Barnes is an underachiever (which is debatable in the tournament I understand) but for argument sake I'm going to compare the 6 years Pearl was here (2005-2011) to the 6 years Barnes was at Texas during (2005-2011). Note: I am not bashing Pearl. He is my favorite coach to coach at Tennessee (didn't get to see Mears coach). This is simply to show people that Barnes is truly a great coach and he has stats to back it up.

Rick Barnes recruiting rankings per rivals...

2014 - 20th
2013 - out of top 25
2012 - 11th
2011 - 8th
2010 - 8th
2009 - 2nd
2008 - out of top 25
2007 - 21st
2006 - 3rd
2005 - out of top 25
2004 - 3rd

For comparison I'm going to give you Pearl's rankings when he was at Tennessee..

2010 - 9th Tobias, Mcrae, Golden
2009 - out of top 25
2008- 7th Hopson, Negedu, Woolridge, Maze
2007 - out of top 25
2006 - 6th Crews, Ramar, Chism
2005 - his first class shouldn't count (out of top 25)

I love Pearl and what he done at UT but I just want to put into perspective of hiw great Barnes is at recruiting.

Yeah but Barnes underachieved with that talent...did he?

From 2005-2011: Barnes made it to 2 elite 8's
From 2005-2011: Pearl made it to 1 elite 8.

During that 6 year span Barnes averaged.

Barnes: 27 wins and 9 loses
Pearl: 24 wins 10 loses

Players drafted in that 6 year span...

Barnes 12 (4 lottery picks)
Lamarcus Aldridge
PJ Tucker
Daniel Gibson
Kevin Durant
DJ Augustin
Avery Bradley
Damion Jones
Trevor Booker
Dexter Pittman
Tristan Thompson
Jordan Hamilton
Cory Joseph

Pearl 2
CJ Watson
Tobias Harris

Again, I do not want to take away from what Pearl did for our program, but I want to put into perspective of how good of a coach Barnes is. He may not be an elite floor coach but the man is an elite recruiter and talent evaluator. Barnes is by far the best candidate we are after. Call him an underachiever all you want but I just proved to you with facts and stats that he accomplished more than my favorite coach Bruce Pearl did during the 6 year span that he was here.

Is he washed up? Well he is averaging 22 wins and 13 loses in the past 5 years and has only missed the tournament once during that period. In recruiting he has been in the top 25 4 out of the 5 past years with two top 10 classes. I believe these past 5 years he started to decline.

Some coaches stay at one place too long and get comfortable. Coach Cal himself said he doesn't plan to stay at UK any longer than 10 years. I think a change of scenery would do well for Barnes and would be the best candidate for us.

 

[Stoked]

Just wanted to say that there might be mistakes in grammar because I am on my phone and the autocorrect has a mind of it's own...lol so don't be too critical on my grammar (grammar Nazi's).

 

[snapcracklepop]

I just hope someone does not outbid us for Barnes. Anyone who does not think he would be a great hire for us is obviously not very smart.

 

[TNsnyper20]

Good comparison.

 

[OrngeJuiceJones]

I just hope someone does not outbid us for Barnes. Anyone who does not think he would be a great hire for us is obviously not very smart.

This x1000. Proven winner in a tough top 5 conference. Proven recruiter with many guys in the nba. Key word.. PROVEN! Bring him to the real UT Dave Hart.

 

[utvolpj]

I just hope someone does not outbid us for Barnes. Anyone who does not think he would be a great hire for us is obviously not very smart.

The question is whether he is the best possible coach we can get. I would bet very few think he is

 

[kohlrums]

He did wonders with 2 lottery picks in the tourney, too. Out in the round of 32 with Kevin Durant and DJ.

His team was completely disjointed this year against Butler with another potential lottery pick on board. He can recruit, awesome. He just can't really coach basketball anymore. Why are we slobbering over a guy who failed at Texas-a school with more resources than anyone in the country? How is it even possible to fail at Texas unless you, I dunno, can't coach?

 

[Probably_in_Class]

Good post. You could argue Pearl had to build a program while during that time period Barnes was already well entrenched, but great job at putting the stats together. I also think Barnes would be a very positive hire.

 

[kohlrums]

I just hope someone does not outbid us for Barnes. Anyone who does not think he would be a great hire for us is obviously not very smart.

Has anyone around here watched a Texas game over the past few years?

Although, for everyone out there who loves coaches who save their timeouts for the next game, and don't draw up plays for end of game situations-Rick is the best bet out there. Let's get him! Hooray-Texas's sloppy seconds. Watch your back, Coach Cal!

 

[Volinmem]

I see too much similarity between the end of Barnes' run and Fulmer's run. Both great coaches, but seem to lose their passion and fire at the end. I don't think Barnes would be a bad hire, but I would like a lot of the others on our list more.

 

[Unimane]

This data skews heavily towards the 2005 start date for Barnes' "success". Otherwise, what I see here is that Barnes had significantly more talent than Pearl with about the same amount of success early on and then dropped off significantly. Oh, and he had a losing record to Pearl.

Besides, we're not looking to hire 2005 Rick Barnes, we are looking at 2015 Rick Barnes.

 

[armchair]

Good post. You could argue Pearl had to build a program while during that time period Barnes was already well entrenched, but great job at putting the stats together. I also think Barnes would be a very positive hire.

Texas has been an established program for a long time, predating Barnes, I believe, and is in a talent-rich state. The Vols have never been established. We've had short periods of success followed by long periods of irrelevancy. Our program was in pretty bad shape when Pearl took over. Also Pearl, being younger, had upside; had he stayed at UT we would have been to more elite 8s if not better. Barnes has qualities and a successful resume--but how much longer does he even want to coach? Even under the best circumstances it will take three years to get this program where we might even make the tourney--and longer to get good, IF he recruits well. Ideally, we want to hire a good, hungry coach in his 40s and hope he stays with UT for at least 10 years. That would be /building and establishing/ a program. Barnes would not stay at UT for 10 years; we'd be lucky to get half that.

 

[Dallasbowlin]

Just wanted to say that there might be mistakes in grammar because I am on my phone and the autocorrect has a mind of it's own...lol so don't be too critical on my grammar (grammar Nazi's).

Shew,stoked, should've went to class

 

[Volhoops]

Is Barnes trending up or down this late in his career ?

 

[gofordrew]

Texas is also a hell of a lot easier to recruit than TN, IMO.

 

[volbeast33]

Texas has been an established program for a long time, predating Barnes, I believe, and is in a talent-rich state. The Vols have never been established. We've had short periods of success followed by long periods of irrelevancy. Our program was in pretty bad shape when Pearl took over. Also Pearl, being younger, had upside; had he stayed at UT we would have been to more elite 8s if not better. Barnes has qualities and a successful resume--but how much longer does he even want to coach? Even under the best circumstances it will take three years to get this program where we might even make the tourney--and longer to get good, IF he recruits well. Ideally, we want to hire a good, hungry coach in his 40s and hope he stays with UT for at least 10 years. That would be /building and establishing/ a program. Barnes would not stay at UT for 10 years; we'd be lucky to get half that.

This is the first time he has ever been fired.....that has a tendency to light a fire under some....

 

[Stoked]

Is Barnes trending up or down this late in his career ?

Down, but would get us trending up if that makes sense. I'm all for hiring an up and comer potential star. But questions is, can Hart find him? That's my only concern. We cannot afford to get this hire wrong. Cannot. Barnes is nothing more of a bandaid and I can admit that. A quick fix to get us going in the right direction.

It's a tough spot to be in I know. But Hart has to go with the safest bet IMO. Not only for his job, but

 

[volbeast33]

Down, but would get us trending up if that makes sense. I'm all for hiring an up and comer potential star. But questions is, can Hart find him? That's my only concern. We cannot afford to get this hire wrong. Cannot. Barnes is nothing more of a bandaid and I can admit that. A quick fix to get us going in the right direction.

It's a tough spot to be in I know. But Hart has to go with the safest bet IMO. Not only for his job, but

Yeah I can handle him pointing us in the right direction

 

[ScreaminVolHawkins]

Just wanted to say that there might be mistakes in grammar because I am on my phone and the autocorrect has a mind of it's own...lol so don't be too critical on my grammar (grammar Nazi's).

:no:

 

[BP4Prez]

Barnes would be a great hire.

 

[blueblood]

Barnes will get you better talent than the last 2 coaches did but he's not going to be recruiting the same way here as he does in Texas.

He'll bring you above average talent, he'll get your hopes up high, and then barely make the dance or NIT and have early exits. His days of elite 8s are behind him and even then only with talent he won't be able to get ever again.

Pearl's best days are possibly ahead of him but why even consider this as it's not going ot happen.

Honestly, if UT is not going to spend the money to get a good coach then your only other good option is to take a chance at a mid-major coach. It's a gamble but at least there is a chance for something there.

 

[pierce60]

Texas is also a hell of a lot easier to recruit than TN, IMO.

What would lead you to believe that? Some of Barnes really good players aren't from Texas (Durant, Tristan Thompson, DJ Augustin, etc.), so it isn't just home grown talent he was bringing in. I'd argue he could have similar success at Tennessee due to its proximity of major metropolitan areas, TN facilities are second to none in college basketball, and Barnes' established influence/reputation on a national level.

 

[HardKnoxVol]

Just so you know, Bill Battle is meeting with Gregg Marshall today for Alabama, yet we can't even get an interview

 

[Special Ed]

Give it a rest, will ya?

 

[HardKnoxVol]

Texas is also a hell of a lot easier to recruit than TN, IMO.

Not necessarily. We have top 3 facilities in the country, especially when it comes to basketball. Our arena looks better than some NBA arenas and holds over 20K people. The fanbase is passionate about basketball. Plus, TN produces a lot of talent, especially in the Nashville and Memphis areas. Not to mention, we can pretty much pluck Georgia for talent. These recruits now still know who we are and what we've done in recent years. We just have to get the right coach to get it all together; a Dan Akroyd (or John Belushi) if you will and getting the band back together.