The 2nd Vanderbilt Postgame Report

[cncchris33]

Wow...what a choke job. You go from down 11 in the 1st half, to close out on a 25-3 run to finish the half. Then take the 2nd half off like Vandy was just gonna lay down. Two separate 13-point leads in the 2nd half, and lose by 8. Just an unbelievable lack of poise, and CDT did himself no favor in winning over fans tonight.

The Good...
1. Anothee strong performance from Willie Carmichael. He's not putting up huge numbers, but he is starting to react and not overthink. I think that is three straight games I have praised his play vs tearing him down. 4 pts, 5 rebs and only 2 fouls, one of which was questionable.

2. Hubbs, I thought played decently in a game where few did. 9 pts, 4 rebs, 2 assts.

3. JRich wasn't great shooting, but he was money at the FT line and finished with 20 pts, 6 rebs, 5 assts, and 0 TOs.

The Bad...
1. Geez, where to start??? Reese, Punter, and Moore were a combined 9-31 from the field. They took 31 of our 59 shots and missed 22 of them...at home.

2. Reese is an enigma wrapped up in a riddle. The kid is so erratic. Dribbles the ball of his foot, loses it out of bounds a few possessions later, hits two big shots, then airballs one, etc. He is such a tweener. Wants to be a guard, but has poor ball-handling skills, has next to no post game, but rebounds well for his size. Not one of his finer games from a consistency standpoint.

3. We let Vandy shoot an absurd 84% from the field, and 82% from 3 in the 2nd half. 58% and 52% for the game. That is pitiful. Meanwhile, we were a whopping 36% and 33% in the 2nd half, and 37% and 31% for the game. The huge gap in shooting percentages and the extraordinarily high percentages we give up to teams is more than an accident at this point. It is a trend, and a very troubling one. Teams have an absolute field day shooting against us, and we don't shoot well leading to our near .500 record.

4. 2-6 at home in conference is pretty unreal. Even more so when compared to our road record. I just don't get it.

5. Have you ever seen a game where a team wins the rebounding battle 37-19, the OReb battle 19-1, outscores the opponent 24-0 on second chance points, has a 25-3 run, and still loses by 8 in a game that wasn't really threatened for the final 6 minutes? I haven't.

Bottom line...
This is the most frustrated I have been at a loss since the Bama game, but even they were a poor matchup for us. Vandy is guard-heavy and not particularly big in the post. They have no decided advantage over us, but they just called their shot, and punked us on our home court. CDT's game-management and TO use really come into question with this one unfortunately. We didn't get out-talented tonight. We got outcoached and we got out-played by a team with no decided advantage other than outside shooting ability. An ability we made no effort to neutralize. Officiating really deteriorated within the final 8 minutes both ways. Just thought I'd mention it because it is many of our fans' go-to move to blame officials. They weren't good, but our play was worse from about the 15:00 mark of the 2nd half to the 2:00 mark. You can't crap the bed for that long when you aren't exponentially better than your opponent.

 

[zjcvols]

It's going to be tough to get a winning season

 

[vols 30]

Good write up. Agree with everything. After watching this team all year, none of this is really surprising.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

It's going to be tough to get a winning season

I thought VU and SC were sure wins but we're so bad at home, I'm not sure SC is a W anymore.

And while we play better on the road, we still haven't been winning very much there either.

 

[A-RodWiLks]

We took way too many bad shots...and Reese has to quit thinking he can dribble. Carmichael actually did play really well. If we had a competent point guard, I think we would have easily won 3 to 5 more games. Josh just looks so worn out in second half. We have very little talent on this team, but they definitely fight...I would be happy with an NIT bid at this point and I'm not giving up on Tyndall, I think he will be a fine coach....in due time.

 

[VolGee4]

I disagree with Vandy not having an inside advantage. They feasted on the high low in the first game with Jones sealing our small forwards. They put Kornett at the high post. That is how you beat that zone.

However, they hardly did that this game because we packed it in a little better and let them shoot. Would you have guessed that Kornett makes 5 threes? You are damned if you do and damned if you don't. You can criticize Donnie for lack of using timeouts, but he knew what he was doing. They just made a bunch of threes. Yes, I understand the trend of making threes. I noticed one late that Richardson had a poor close out. But the strategy is the correct one. You have to do it based on our personnel. I don't know what else he is supposed to do. I just don't believe it simply means he was out coached. Shooting 9-11 from 3 at one point means Stallings is a better coach? It just doesn't.

 

[orbs son]

I wouldn't say we were outcoached, but we were very poorly coached in the second half. Reese is a back up 3 at best.

 

[k-town_king]

Horrible coaching. No other way to spin it.

 

[cncchris33]

I disagree with Vandy not having an inside advantage. They feasted on the high low in the first game with Jones sealing our small forwards. They put Kornett at the high post. That is how you beat that zone.

However, they hardly did that this game because we packed it in a little better and let them shoot. Would you have guessed that Kornett makes 5 threes? You are damned if you do and damned if you don't. You can criticize Donnie for lack of using timeouts, but he knew what he was doing. They just made a bunch of threes. Yes, I understand the trend of making threes. I noticed one late that Richardson had a poor close out. But the strategy is the correct one. You have to do it based on our personnel. I don't know what else he is supposed to do. I just don't believe it simply means he was out coached. Shooting 9-11 from 3 at one point means Stallings is a better coach? It just doesn't.

Vandy's tallest player (Kornet) doesn't play like a traditional 7-footer. He isn't a back-to-the-basket player who grabs 8-10 boards. I agree with Jones, but across the board, I don't see them as having a decided advantage in the post. We completely neutralized him for most of the game before it essentially all fell apart.

We can agree to disagree on the coaching aspect. You'll see what you want, and vice-versa. I feel CDT didn't use his opportunities to kill their momentum and to lay into his own team before it got out of hand. I also feel he didn't do enough to adjust to Vandy's hot shooting. Extend the zone for a few possessions, even if it means giving up some looks in closer. I just don't think you can let a good shooting team get into a rhythm like that, because it typically snowballs the momentum. It's not like they were hitting 50% from there. They were an unconscious 80%+. Again, agree to disagree.

 

[Ace]

After a tough night, we all need a good laugh, check out this thread in the recruiting forum:
http://www.volnation.com/forum/tennessee-vols-recruiting/236055-16-az-rb-white-llama.html

 

[keckjm]

I disagree with Vandy not having an inside advantage. They feasted on the high low in the first game with Jones sealing our small forwards. They put Kornett at the high post. That is how you beat that zone.

However, they hardly did that this game because we packed it in a little better and let them shoot. Would you have guessed that Kornett makes 5 threes? You are damned if you do and damned if you don't. You can criticize Donnie for lack of using timeouts, but he knew what he was doing. They just made a bunch of threes. Yes, I understand the trend of making threes. I noticed one late that Richardson had a poor close out. But the strategy is the correct one. You have to do it based on our personnel. I don't know what else he is supposed to do. I just don't believe it simply means he was out coached. Shooting 9-11 from 3 at one point means Stallings is a better coach? It just doesn't.

Yeap. You can't extended the zone when teams can feed the post. The only reason Vandy didn't feed the post is because they shot 9-11 from three. They had a huge size advantage on us, and they affected our offensive shots in the post all game.

I'm also aware that threes count more than twos, but when Moore fouls out in 10 mins, due to him guarding guys 5 inches bigger than him, let me know how we play after that. We have zero post players. Zero. None. I know we have some basketball knowledge on this board, but we are all going to have to agree to disagree that Tyndall has other options. Without his zone, we don't score more than 35 most nights. We had 19 offensive rebounds, but the issue is, many of them are coming from Moore who's 6'5" or our other guards. We have no one who can consistently put the ball back in off rebounds. Zero size inside. Willie has potential, but he has zero basketball touch right now. So, every time we rebound the ball on the offensive end our best bet is to pull it out most the time and set our offense back up. The problem with that is Josh and Moore create most our offense, and those guys are worn down. You can't play guys 35+ mins a night and expect good to come of it...

We just don't have the talent or depth to do a lot of basketball formations right now. Basically, no option Tyndall goes with is a good option from here on out. We are worn down bad.

The only concern right now should be Tyndall's recruiting. Hopefully it picks up once the NCAA leaves him alone. Outside that, his trend here is exactly how it was at his other stops. He knows what he's doing. That's why he's won consistently in every conference he's coached in. We are in good hands. We just don't have a lot of talent to work with right now. Need our freshman to work really hard this offseason, and we need Hubbs, Reese, Punter, and Baulkman to take the next step to help Moore out next year.

Go Vols. Keep the faith guys. :rock:

 

[Lefteye]

Horrible coaching. No other way to spin it.

.

 

[Lefteye]

After a tough night, we all need a good laugh, check out this thread in the recruiting forum:
http://www.volnation.com/forum/tennessee-vols-recruiting/236055-16-az-rb-white-llama.html

I hate the white llama! He had some late 3s that stuck a fork in us tonight.

 

[VolGee4]

Vandy's tallest player (Kornet) doesn't play like a traditional 7-footer. He isn't a back-to-the-basket player who grabs 8-10 boards. I agree with Jones, but across the board, I don't see them as having a decided advantage in the post. We completely neutralized him for most of the game before it essentially all fell apart.

We can agree to disagree on the coaching aspect. You'll see what you want, and vice-versa. I feel CDT didn't use his opportunities to kill their momentum and to lay into his own team before it got out of hand. I also feel he didn't do enough to adjust to Vandy's hot shooting. Extend the zone for a few possessions, even if it means giving up some looks in closer. I just don't think you can let a good shooting team get into a rhythm like that, because it typically snowballs the momentum. It's not like they were hitting 50% from there. They were an unconscious 80%+. Again, agree to disagree.

Good debate is healthy. Kornett is perfect for the high post- 7 footer who can shoot. He played that role in the first game. That was good coaching. I had nightmares of the high post pass to a low post Jones because they did it so much in the first game.

They went away from that in this game because we packed it in a little better. But who is going to really close out on a 7 footer? If you have two legit players at the 3 and 4 who are at least 6'6"+, then you can. We don't have that luxury. Our PG, who should be a 3, is playing at the top of the zone. Kornett got looks on the baseline and deep wings.

Look, I am not saying that coaching was excellent, but I think we all can agree that our personnel is a problem and dictates what we do. I know some would disagree, but I let teams beat me from the outside instead of letting them lob it over the top and dunk like Jones did. The 3 is a lower percentage shot, and it is the correct strategy against teams like Mississippi State, who was last in the league in 3 point strategy. Teams just have better nights against you. But nothing will change until we get a better roster.

 

[cncchris33]

Good debate is healthy. Kornett is perfect for the high post- 7 footer who can shoot. He played that role in the first game. That was good coaching. I had nightmares of the high post pass to a low post Jones because they did it so much in the first game.

They went away from that in this game because we packed it in a little better. But who is going to really close out on a 7 footer? If you have two legit players at the 3 and 4 who are at least 6'6"+, then you can. We don't have that luxury. Our PG, who should be a 3, is playing at the top of the zone. Kornett got looks on the baseline and deep wings.

Look, I am not saying that coaching was excellent, but I think we all can agree that our personnel is a problem and dictates what we do. I know some would disagree, but I let teams beat me from the outside instead of letting them lob it over the top and dunk like Jones did. The 3 is a lower percentage shot, and it is the correct strategy against teams like Mississippi State, who was last in the league in 3 point strategy. Teams just have better nights against you. But nothing will change until we get a better roster.

Definitely agree our roster makeup is the biggest issue and contributes to what we can and can't do.

 

[Lefteye]

An elephant in the room tonight is KP not being able to throw it in the ocean. We have an issue finding shooters anybody that's anybody knows that. But the zone has had enough success that I don't believe its system.

I honestly don't know why CDT hasn't drilled recognize the shooter and rotate if your backside and see a teamate get beat. Or if you have a low/middle assignment don't float so far you can't recover. I want to believe, because of this investigation and with the controversy over the previous coaches leaving, its hard to be 100% credible and impactful with all of your guys. And once the cloud is lifted and he gets all guys, that came here to play his system, that he will be the coach I believe he is. But time will tell.

 

[keckjm]

An elephant in the room tonight is KP not being able to throw it in the ocean. We have an issue finding shooters anybody that's anybody knows that. But the zone has had enough success that I don't believe its system.

I honestly don't know why CDT hasn't drilled recognize the shooter and rotate if your backside and see a teamate get beat. Or if you have a low/middle assignment don't float so far you can't recover. I want to believe, because of this investigation and with the controversy over the previous coaches leaving, its hard to be 100% credible and impactful with all of your guys. And once the cloud is lifted and he gets all guys, that came here to play his system, that he will be the coach I believe he is. But time will tell.

The goal to beating a zone is to attack gaps and try to create 3-2 matchups in your favor. Our zone does a great job of containing the attacking ball man, but the kick out and recovery process is tiring on a defense. When you have three shooters all over the floor you have to close out hard or otherwise you are going to leave guys wide open. If you extend the zone you also extend the soft points in your zone, thus creating more room for the offense to exploit a 3-2 matchup on you. Almost every zone offense utilizes a slashing guard to the corner three, a post player down low, and a overloaded front. You can then run off ball screens, high-lows, etc. In the end, size and shooters trump scheme. You can scheme a zone defense all you want, but the most effective defense against great shooting teams is man to man, something our current team has no business running.

 

[bnhunt]

That charge call on Armani Moore toward the end of the game was legendarily bad and a huge swing in momentum. I believe if that call isn't blown we are down 5 with Moore going to the line for 1. There is no way that was a charge as the VU player was near the restricted area, if not in it, and moving sideways. Just an awful call. Vandy is a joke too - their idiot player talking trash and taunting UT like they are worth a damn.

 

[CAVol]

That charge call on Armani Moore toward the end of the game was legendarily bad and a huge swing in momentum. I believe if that call isn't blown we are down 5 with Moore going to the line for 1. There is no way that was a charge as the VU player was near the restricted area, if not in it, and moving sideways. Awful call.

There are bad calls in every game. We should have never been in a position where that is a deciding factor. We blew the game.

 

[iKrager]

The 2nd half was rough. That call on Armani to give him his 4th foul was the final nail for our coffin. If he made the play he would of cut it to a 3 pt game going to the line. I'm not blaming it on the officiating but that was a bad call.

You forgot to mention:
- Devon Baulkman played well tonight despite 4 turnovers, 2 of which he stepped out but had 4 rebounds, 2 steal, 1 assist and 5 pts. We need to find more opportunities for Devon to shoot the ball.


- Did Detrick Mostella even play tonight? ESPN Box score shows he didn't

- Carmichael didn't look freaked out and actually looked into the game. He rebounded well and the few points he had were nice moves.

- Forgot to mention Derek Reese's offensive performance. He was one of two players (Richie) to score double figures. Derek continues to get beat defensively though and it's frustrating to watch.

 

[OrangeBalls]

Wow...what a choke job. You go from down 11 in the 1st half, to close out on a 25-3 run to finish the half. Then take the 2nd half off like Vandy was just gonna lay down. Two separate 13-point leads in the 2nd half, and lose by 8. Just an unbelievable lack of poise, and CDT did himself no favor in winning over fans tonight.

The Good...
1. Anothee strong performance from Willie Carmichael. He's not putting up huge numbers, but he is starting to react and not overthink. I think that is three straight games I have praised his play vs tearing him down. 4 pts, 5 rebs and only 2 fouls, one of which was questionable.

2. Hubbs, I thought played decently in a game where few did. 9 pts, 4 rebs, 2 assts.

3. JRich wasn't great shooting, but he was money at the FT line and finished with 20 pts, 6 rebs, 5 assts, and 0 TOs.

The Bad...
1. Geez, where to start??? Reese, Punter, and Moore were a combined 9-31 from the field. They took 31 of our 59 shots and missed 22 of them...at home.

2. Reese is an enigma wrapped up in a riddle. The kid is so erratic. Dribbles the ball of his foot, loses it out of bounds a few possessions later, hits two big shots, then airballs one, etc. He is such a tweener. Wants to be a guard, but has poor ball-handling skills, has next to no post game, but rebounds well for his size. Not one of his finer games from a consistency standpoint.

3. We let Vandy shoot an absurd 84% from the field, and 82% from 3 in the 2nd half. 58% and 52% for the game. That is pitiful. Meanwhile, we were a whopping 36% and 33% in the 2nd half, and 37% and 31% for the game. The huge gap in shooting percentages and the extraordinarily high percentages we give up to teams is more than an accident at this point. It is a trend, and a very troubling one. Teams have an absolute field day shooting against us, and we don't shoot well leading to our near .500 record.

4. 2-6 at home in conference is pretty unreal. Even more so when compared to our road record. I just don't get it.

5. Have you ever seen a game where a team wins the rebounding battle 37-19, the OReb battle 19-1, outscores the opponent 24-0 on second chance points, has a 25-3 run, and still loses by 8 in a game that wasn't really threatened for the final 6 minutes? I haven't.

Bottom line...
This is the most frustrated I have been at a loss since the Bama game, but even they were a poor matchup for us. Vandy is guard-heavy and not particularly big in the post. They have no decided advantage over us, but they just called their shot, and punked us on our home court. CDT's game-management and TO use really come into question with this one unfortunately. We didn't get out-talented tonight. We got outcoached and we got out-played by a team with no decided advantage other than outside shooting ability. An ability we made no effort to neutralize. Officiating really deteriorated within the final 8 minutes both ways. Just thought I'd mention it because it is many of our fans' go-to move to blame officials. They weren't good, but our play was worse from about the 15:00 mark of the 2nd half to the 2:00 mark. You can't crap the bed for that long when you aren't exponentially better than your opponent.

I agree with most of it but I'm going to side with VolGee4 on getting outcoached. We're getting out-talented for the most part. We have no one that consistently helps Josh night in and night out. One night it might be Punter, the next night it might be Moore, but there is rarely the same 1-2 guys that help Richardson out every night. Yes, Tyndall could've called some timeouts to try and stifle their shooting, but they shot lights out just like a poor shooting Miss St team did. I don't think Vandy is particularly that good, but the Miss St loss is worse IMO.

The biggest head scratcher is how bad to average we play at home. We're not that great of a team period, but this might be one of the worst home UT teams I've ever seen. Chalk that up to a new coach/system and inexperienced players and lack of talent. However, even those type of teams seem to play above their heads at times. I guess the Butler and Ark games were our high water mark this year.

 

[SeniorDrill]

Just a minor detail that seems to be overlooked. It is hard to beat any team that scores 39 points from three point land, not even Kentucky would have withstood that barrage. JMO.

 

[VolGee4]

There are bad calls in every game. We should have never been in a position where that is a deciding factor. We blew the game.

Still, it's making the game unwatchable. People can say calls don't lose games, but they still effect games. They effect what you do afterward.

I am not giving up on the team, but I may be giving up a little on the game. The product of officiating is simply horrific.

 

[cncchris33]

The 2nd half was rough. That call on Armani to give him his 4th foul was the final nail for our coffin. If he made the play he would of cut it to a 3 pt game going to the line. I'm not blaming it on the officiating but that was a bad call.

You forgot to mention:
- Devon Baulkman played well tonight despite 4 turnovers, 2 of which he stepped out but had 4 rebounds, 2 steal, 1 assist and 5 pts. We need to find more opportunities for Devon to shoot the ball.


- Did Detrick Mostella even play tonight? ESPN Box score shows he didn't

- Carmichael didn't look freaked out and actually looked into the game. He rebounded well and the few points he had were nice moves.

- Forgot to mention Derek Reese's offensive performance. He was one of two players (Richie) to score double figures. Derek continues to get beat defensively though and it's frustrating to watch.

I talked about Carmichael in my first bullet point. Mostella didn't play, which I found odd. Also, given Reese's defensive struggles, I found it odd that Owens only played 2 minutes. Reese scored in double figures, but he did it on 40% shooting from the "PF/C" position and committed 4 TOs (all unforced) along the way. 7 3-pt attempts is too many for him too. The flipside to that is he is very limited in terms of post moves. So, for him to score, it has to be on garbage shots under the basket, uncontested dunks or layups, or shooting 3s. He just isn't a great shooter. For that matter, 26 3-pt attempts is too many for this team.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Just a minor detail that seems to be overlooked. It is hard to beat any team that scores 39 points from three point land, not even Kentucky would have withstood that barrage. JMO.

Yes they would have.