Josh Selby

[keckjm]

IMO A coach has little to do with the development of a player. Players get to the next level working on their own in the gym at 6 AM shooting baskets, doing drills with trainers and getting more on court experience regardless if its a RTL game or NCAA tourney game.

I believe sometimes coaches can have a big impact on a player, but it generally has less to do with basketball and more to do with getting their life together so they can put themselves in a position to succeed


I agree with this; however, coaches do have an effect on players in many ways still. Maymon and Golden are night and day since Martin has arrived here. Now, clearly Martin doesn't have some magic power, but he has found ways to get the best out of those two guys. I think Tom Izzo is notorious for this. Yea, he has some great players come in, but he also has a system where a 3/4 star player can turn out to be a great player AKA Draymond Green. I think it's all about stability and knowing what you want to do as a coach. If you're a coach that wants tons of shooters on the floor, then you might not want to go after 4, 5 star guys. This is why I say stars are overrated. Yes, they do judge talent pretty well, but they don't judge a players ability to fit within a given system. I'm not saying Martin should go after guys that have scholarship offers from Carson Newman, but I have no problem with him getting guys like Moore, as long as he can consistently prove he knows what he's doing on player evaluations. At this moment everyone has to trust Martin with his evaluations.

[volbeast33]

Originally Posted by zansdad

Orton's size and athleticism would have gotten him a shot in the league with or without Calipari. He was a 5* coming out of high school and without the 1 and done requirement may have never played in college. Size is always at a premium. Where Calipari's influence is most visible is with Liggins and Harrelson. The is no universe where a person can argue that Harrelson is a better player than Wayne Chism and yet Harrelson is playing and Chism is not.

It is all about measurables in the NBA, both Liggins and Harrelson have an NBA body....Liggins was viewed as a defensive stopper that can hit an open three, Harrelson gives a team a big bodied rebounder that can hit an open shot. Chism was listed as 6-8, 9 here at Tennessee and I think his official height was less than that which killed any shot at the NBA.

[volbeast33]

Originally Posted by keckjm

IMO A coach has little to do with the development of a player. Players get to the next level working on their own in the gym at 6 AM shooting baskets, doing drills with trainers and getting more on court experience regardless if its a RTL game or NCAA tourney game.

I believe sometimes coaches can have a big impact on a player, but it generally has less to do with basketball and more to do with getting their life together so they can put themselves in a position to succeed


I agree with this; however, coaches do have an effect on players in many ways still. Maymon and Golden are night and day since Martin has arrived here. Now, clearly Martin doesn't have some magic power, but he has found ways to get the best out of those two guys. I think Tom Izzo is notorious for this. Yea, he has some great players come in, but he also has a system where a 3/4 star player can turn out to be a great player AKA Draymond Green. I think it's all about stability and knowing what you want to do as a coach. If you're a coach that wants tons of shooters on the floor, then you might not want to go after 4, 5 star guys. This is why I say stars are overrated. Yes, they do judge talent pretty well, but they don't judge a players ability to fit within a given system. I'm not saying Martin should go after guys that have scholarship offers from Carson Newman, but I have no problem with him getting guys like Moore, as long as he can consistently prove he knows what he's doing on player evaluations. At this moment everyone has to trust Martin with his evaluations.

They have improved quite a bit but both showed potential the year before. The last coaching change we had several players improved alot from the yr before as well.

[volbeast33]

Originally Posted by bleedingTNorange

Orton is 6'10 250, not exactly a freak of nature. I disagree that if he rode the pine for Tennessee for a year that he'd have been drafted as a lottery pick.

Very true about Harrelson chism comparison, but look at what you said above, size. Harrelson is 6'10 275 and chism measure out at 6'8" 240lbs. That's a big size difference, if chism was 6'10 275 he'd be in the league. That was te big knock on him coming out of college was he was undersized for the league.

Orton was not drafted as a Lottery pick at Kentucky either. Having good measurables and alot of potential was helped by sitting behind the studs at kentucky. It would not have looked as good riding the pine behind Brian Williams. LOL

[bleedingTNorange]

Originally Posted by volbeast33

Orton was not drafted as a Lottery pick at Kentucky either. Having good measurables and alot of potential was helped by sitting behind the studs at kentucky. It would not have looked as good riding the pine behind Brian Williams. LOL

My apologies first round.

He has been a bust in the NBA, he didn't show he deserved to be drafted at UK and he hasn't done anything to prove otherwise since.

As I said I think playing for cal and behind a good C boosted his draft stock. If he'd have averaged those numbers at any other school I doubt he'd have been a first rounder.

[omghulkhands]

Originally Posted by volbeast33

It is all about measurables in the NBA, both Liggins and Harrelson have an NBA body....Liggins was viewed as a defensive stopper that can hit an open three, Harrelson gives a team a big bodied rebounder that can hit an open shot. Chism was listed as 6-8, 9 here at Tennessee and I think his official height was less than that which killed any shot at the NBA.

yeah I was just getting ready to post that if Chism is 6-8 then then the moon is made of cheese

[volbeast33]

Originally Posted by bleedingTNorange

My apologies first round.

He has been a bust in the NBA, he didn't show he deserved to be drafted at UK and he hasn't done anything to prove otherwise since.

As I said I think playing for cal and behind a good C boosted his draft stock. If he'd have averaged those numbers at any other school I doubt he'd have been a first rounder.

I don't think it had anything to do with cal but being behind a dominant center helped hide his deficiencies...Even in the lottery and definitely late first round to second the draft is based off potential. Orton was a big bodied highly rated center. Several players didn't do a lot in college that got drafted in the NBA based off potential.

[zansdad]

Originally Posted by volbeast33

It is all about measurables in the NBA, both Liggins and Harrelson have an NBA body....Liggins was viewed as a defensive stopper that can hit an open three, Harrelson gives a team a big bodied rebounder that can hit an open shot. Chism was listed as 6-8, 9 here at Tennessee and I think his official height was less than that which killed any shot at the NBA.

Every school exaggerates their players measurables. Harrellson measured an inch taller than Chism. 6'8 1/2" to 6'7 1/2". Not exactly what I would call an NBA body or a difference maker between Jorts and Weezy. Chism actually had a longer wingspan and taller standing reach despite being an inch shorter

DraftExpressProfile: Josh Harrellson, Stats, Comparisons, and Outlook

DraftExpressProfile: Wayne Chism, Stats, Comparisons, and Outlook

[TVolRedsox]

Originally Posted by give_him 6

For Selby to consider the Vols was something. I remember back when Vols men's basketball was a joke. To have or had a coach that could recruit against Kansas, UNC, UK was something else.

I live in an area that follows KU. Selby really underperformed as a jay hawk but had he stayed would have been another great one from KU.

Sorry to say this being a UNC student you have NEVER recruited against Kansas, UNC, and UK. Bruce had to cheat to try and get Aaron craft, and Josh Selby and guess what STILL couldn't land them. Hand Selby a stack of cash and he still went else where. Yes Tennessee basketball became relevant, but no they did not go into relevant recruiting wars with UNC ever, Kentucky ever, Kansas well bill self is a douche so possibly them!

[TVolRedsox]

Originally Posted by DeepSpringsVol

My thoughts exactly. Coaches can hide the bust when they don't have to get off the bench because one or two elite players are playing on same team.

Ya the 5 * UNC and UK miss don't matter, they have someone who.can develop. Let's see how much stokes progresses next year, needs to improve monumentally to live up to that 5* ranking, ya Harrison Barnes sorry we did happen to get one that happened to be all about me.....

[zansdad]

Originally Posted by TVolRedsox

Sorry to say this being a UNC student you have NEVER recruited against Kansas, UNC, and UK. Bruce had to cheat to try and get Aaron craft, and Josh Selby and guess what STILL couldn't land them. Hand Selby a stack of cash and he still went else where. Yes Tennessee basketball became relevant, but no they did not go into relevant recruiting wars with UNC ever, Kentucky ever, Kansas well bill self is a douche so possibly them!

Tobias Harris - Yahoo! Sports

Scotty Hopson - Yahoo! Sports

Duke Crews - Yahoo! Sports

Wrong at least 3 times. You sure you're a UT fan? Maybe you're just a Pearl hater, but your post sounded more anti-UT than anything else.

[tennrich1]

Originally Posted by TVolRedsox

Sorry to say this being a UNC student you have NEVER recruited against Kansas, UNC, and UK. Bruce had to cheat to try and get Aaron craft, and Josh Selby and guess what STILL couldn't land them. Hand Selby a stack of cash and he still went else where. Yes Tennessee basketball became relevant, but no they did not go into relevant recruiting wars with UNC ever, Kentucky ever, Kansas well bill self is a douche so possibly them!

I'll have a double dose of the narcotics this boy's on...while I'm here...pull my wisdom teeth...not often have I witnessed a dumber post than this!!!!

[zansdad]

Originally Posted by TVolRedsox

Ya the 5 * UNC and UK miss don't matter, they have someone who.can develop. Let's see how much stokes progresses next year, needs to improve monumentally to live up to that 5* ranking, ya Harrison Barnes sorry we did happen to get one that happened to be all about me.....

Another dig at UT. You do realize Stokes was supposed to be playing in high school last year, right?

I am beginning to think you are one of those UT football/UNC basketball fans. I think there is medication for that.

[keckjm]

Originally Posted by zansdad

Another dig at UT. You do realize Stokes was supposed to be playing in high school last year, right?

I am beginning to think you are one of those UT football/UNC basketball fans. I think there is medication for that.

Yea, it's called GTFO!

[cncchris33]

Originally Posted by TVolRedsox

Sorry to say this being a UNC student you have NEVER recruited against Kansas, UNC, and UK. Bruce had to cheat to try and get Aaron craft, and Josh Selby and guess what STILL couldn't land them. Hand Selby a stack of cash and he still went else where. Yes Tennessee basketball became relevant, but no they did not go into relevant recruiting wars with UNC ever, Kentucky ever, Kansas well bill self is a douche so possibly them!

Geez, where to start? Pearl didn't cheat to get Craft. Didn't cheat to get Selby. As Zan said, Duke Crews chose Tennessee over UNC, Georgetown, among others. Hopson chose Tennessee over Kentucky. Selby chose Tennessee and decommitted and went to Kansas.

The only thing accurate in your post were the names.