Baby vols

#1

dapeak

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2014
Messages
1,045
Likes
3,091
#1
In the recruiting thread I was reading comments regarding some of the baby vols and honestly they were my favorite group of players. They went through so much together which is horrible. Because of that thread I took a look back at that roster to see the assemblage of talent and honestly had these girls not been injured they would have won a national title or two. Maybe not that first year but the second they definitely had it all except. I honestly believe a healthy Mcmahan and Bass would have been a good pg tandem. Bjorklund , Stricklen, Manning, and Gray on the wings would have been(and was) great size and talent on the wings. With Baugh, Cain, Brewer, and Johnson down low this team would have been unstoppable. They were honestly the team that frustrated me the most because they always would come so close to looking like they got over the jump but had so many factors working against them.

2008-09 Lady Vol Basketball Lineup(healthy)

Mcmahan/Bass/Smallbone
Bjorklund/Manning
Stricklen/Gray
Baugh/Johnson
Cain/Brewer

Once again they may not have won it all that first year but I see this group of ladies winning at least 2 together.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#2
#2
In the recruiting thread I was reading comments regarding some of the baby vols and honestly they were my favorite group of players. They went through so much together which is horrible. Because of that thread I took a look back at that roster to see the assemblage of talent and honestly had these girls not been injured they would have won a national title or two. Maybe not that first year but the second they definitely had it all except. I honestly believe a healthy Mcmahan and Bass would have been a good pg tandem. Bjorklund , Stricklen, Manning, and Gray on the wings would have been(and was) great size and talent on the wings. With Baugh, Cain, Brewer, and Johnson down low this team would have been unstoppable. They were honestly the team that frustrated me the most because they always would come so close to looking like they got over the jump but had so many factors working against them.

2008-09 Lady Vol Basketball Lineup(healthy)

Mcmahan/Bass/Smallbone
Bjorklund/Manning
Stricklen/Gray
Baugh/Johnson
Cain/Brewer

Once again they may not have won it all that first year but I see this group of ladies winning at least 2 together.

I also believe we would have been tough to beat and possibly won 1 or 2 titles. I think we were kind of thin at the PG spot and expected Bass to do for us what Bobbit did and imo she wasn't a strong vocal leader which kind of hurt and Bjorklund didn't really try to add more to her arsenal than being a shooter. Baugh's injuries hurt because I think she was the X factor (as we saw Brewer was a head case) and we also still had Alex Fuller who was the glue of the team imo! Bass' injuries and inability to truly live up to expectations hurt because we had to force Stricklen to play the point (which she did an awesome job) but it hurt us because we wasn't as potent as we could've been!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#5
#5
You vastly overestimate that group of players.

Mcmahan/Bass/Smallbone: A very weak group of guards that is evidence of how badly our talent evaluation and recruiting fell off. Bass and Smallbone should have been at small colleges. Smallbone played little and Bass wasn't very good. Some here think that McMahan would have been a very good player were it not for her knee issues. Not really. She was very average athletically. Basically, we struck out with these recruits.

Bjorklund and Manning: Bjorklund had qualities--I liked her. She was smart, played hard, a good shooter, but she lacked quickness. Something happened to her late in her senior year; I recall that he last game was maybe the worst of her career. Not sure what happened. Manning was yet another PS recruit who was not athletic enough to be a good basketball player. Had /some/ talent--but was kind of slow. Summit got into this weird habit of recruiting heady players, players who could shoot--but the vast majorty of them were all slow. She started recruiting a lot of guards from Indiana--there was another undersized girl from that state--and really none of them was very good. It was bizarre. Recall that we went TWO years without a legit point guard--best program in the country and our guard play was awful.

Same with the bigs: Cain and Brewer were big and slow. Stricklin could play--she was the ONLY ONE in that group that panned out, though I don't remember too much about Gray and Johnson. Unlike McMahan, Baugh's knee problems DID prevent her from having a great career. A shame. I think she had one halfway healthy year, as I recall--and even that was problematic because she'd been sitting for a couple of years.

Contrary to your argument, this group shows very well why our program started to tumble. I don't mean to sound harsh, I like and respect them all for coming to UT and being Vols, but most of them simply lacked big-time talent. I was a big fan of Bjorklund, and it was unfortunate that she didn't have much help on her teams.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
#6
#6
Ehhhh Huh????
Brewer was SEC Sixth Woman Of The Year and SEC Tourney MVP, Cain was first team all SEC. So when they were healthy they produced and were effective. Brewer had knee issues and Cain had ongoing issues with her feet and knee's that she couldn't seem to get over. 09-2011 bigs did their jobs it was lack of guard play which held them back


You vastly overestimate that group of players.

Mcmahan/Bass/Smallbone: A very weak group of guards that is evidence of how badly our talent evaluation and recruiting fell off. Bass and Smallbone should have been at small colleges. Smallbone played little and Bass wasn't very good. Some here think that McMahan would have been a very good player were it not for her knee issues. Not really. She was very average athletically. Basically, we struck out with these recruits.

Bjorklund and Manning: Bjorklund had qualities--I liked her. She was smart, played hard, a good shooter, but she lacked quickness. Something happened to her late in her senior year; I recall that he last game was maybe the worst of her career. Not sure what happened. Manning was yet another PS recruit who was not athletic enough to be a good basketball player. Had /some/ talent--but was kind of slow. Summit got into this weird habit of recruiting heady players, players who could shoot--but the vast majorty of them were all slow. She started recruiting a lot of guards from Indiana--there was another undersized girl from that state--and really none of them was very good. It was bizarre. Recall that we went TWO years without a legit point guard--best program in the country and our guard play was awful.

Same with the bigs: Cain and Brewer were big and slow. Stricklin could play--she was the ONLY ONE in that group that panned out, though I don't remember too much about Gray and Johnson. Unlike McMahan, Baugh's knee problems DID prevent her from having a great career. A shame. I think she had one halfway healthy year, as I recall--and even that was problematic because she'd been sitting for a couple of years.

Contrary to your argument, this group shows very well why our program started to tumble. I don't mean to sound harsh, I like and respect them all for coming to UT and being Vols, but most of them simply lacked big-time talent. I was a big fan of Bjorklund, and it was unfortunate that she didn't have much help on her teams.
 
#7
#7
You vastly overestimate that group of players.

Mcmahan/Bass/Smallbone: A very weak group of guards that is evidence of how badly our talent evaluation and recruiting fell off. Bass and Smallbone should have been at small colleges. Smallbone played little and Bass wasn't very good. Some here think that McMahan would have been a very good player were it not for her knee issues. Not really. She was very average athletically. Basically, we struck out with these recruits.

Bjorklund and Manning: Bjorklund had qualities--I liked her. She was smart, played hard, a good shooter, but she lacked quickness. Something happened to her late in her senior year; I recall that he last game was maybe the worst of her career. Not sure what happened. Manning was yet another PS recruit who was not athletic enough to be a good basketball player. Had /some/ talent--but was kind of slow. Summit got into this weird habit of recruiting heady players, players who could shoot--but the vast majorty of them were all slow. She started recruiting a lot of guards from Indiana--there was another undersized girl from that state--and really none of them was very good. It was bizarre. Recall that we went TWO years without a legit point guard--best program in the country and our guard play was awful.

Same with the bigs: Cain and Brewer were big and slow. Stricklin could play--she was the ONLY ONE in that group that panned out, though I don't remember too much about Gray and Johnson. Unlike McMahan, Baugh's knee problems DID prevent her from having a great career. A shame. I think she had one halfway healthy year, as I recall--and even that was problematic because she'd been sitting for a couple of years.

Contrary to your argument, this group shows very well why our program started to tumble. I don't mean to sound harsh, I like and respect them all for coming to UT and being Vols, but most of them simply lacked big-time talent. I was a big fan of Bjorklund, and it was unfortunate that she didn't have much help on her teams.


Smallbone is the only one that I thought was just not good at all. I'm not saying Bass nor Mcmahan would have been the next Sims or even Bobbit but they would have been serviceable if healthy imho. Bjorklund is given a lot of slack but she was a good- great college player. She was a good complimentary piece to Strick. As you said Strickland was a star in college no doubt and had she been able to only play her position as probably would have had an even greater career. The posts were all unhealthy but when they were healthy we were able to see that they were great players. Cain(I know first-hand how good she was she played in high school with my cousin) was much more agile before her knee issues. She was able to dunk and get up ad down the court. Was a great defensive presence and had the ability to score. Brewer we saw glimpses of how good she could be. Johnson was/is an athletic freak of nature. She was a great rebounder and a good scorer. Baugh was very good when she was semi healthy so completely healthy there is no doubt in my mind she would have been great. These girls were not given a fair chance wrt their health and the media. I honestly believe wish Parker had stayed that last year because they needed direction that they unfortunately were never able to receive from an older player. Fuller was good(I actually really like her) but she just was not enough. I thought she was a talented enough player but her on court game didn't speak enough to lead those girls.
 
#8
#8
Most of those comments about the "baby" class were right on. It seemed when Bass did play well we only saw her for a little bit. Just like Luaren Avant girl she came in to save our bacon in the Vandy game and was never seen again(before she decided to leave), Demoss admittedly said she had to remind Pat she was on the bench. She did mess up Strickland by insisting she play point guard. Then turned around and berated the guards for their play, when it was really her fault that we had no point guard.(signs of the beginning of the end?) I do think McMahan would have been a good guard for us because she was smart and has true guard instincts.
 
#9
#9
Smallbone is the only one that I thought was just not good at all. I'm not saying Bass nor Mcmahan would have been the next Sims or even Bobbit but they would have been serviceable if healthy imho. Bjorklund is given a lot of slack but she was a good- great college player. She was a good complimentary piece to Strick. As you said Strickland was a star in college no doubt and had she been able to only play her position as probably would have had an even greater career. The posts were all unhealthy but when they were healthy we were able to see that they were great players. Cain(I know first-hand how good she was she played in high school with my cousin) was much more agile before her knee issues. She was able to dunk and get up ad down the court. Was a great defensive presence and had the ability to score. Brewer we saw glimpses of how good she could be. Johnson was/is an athletic freak of nature. She was a great rebounder and a good scorer. Baugh was very good when she was semi healthy so completely healthy there is no doubt in my mind she would have been great. These girls were not given a fair chance wrt their health and the media. I honestly believe wish Parker had stayed that last year because they needed direction that they unfortunately were never able to receive from an older player. Fuller was good(I actually really like her) but she just was not enough. I thought she was a talented enough player but her on court game didn't speak enough to lead those girls.

I also wish Parker would have stay another year and I feel had she did we would have won a 3rd title! Parker was able to play the 1-5 so when our PG play was shaky and we were force to play Stricklen at the Point (which minimized the damage she could have done) it wouldn't have hurt us. A starting line up of;

PG-Stricklen
SG-Bjorklund
SF-Parker
PF-Johnson
C-Cain

With a bench of;
PG-Bass/McMahan
SG-Manning/Smallbone
SF-Fuller
PF-Baugh
C-Brewer

We had the luxury of playing Parker at the 1 if we needed to spell Stricklen or wanted a bigger lineup! Parker would have also been a more vocal leader than Fuller was and with her and Glory Athletically and Brewer, Baugh, & Cain (12 Blocks) defensively it would have been tough for anyone to beat us in the tournament! We lacked a go to player at the time with Sticklen having to play the Point and we wouldn't have lacked a go to player had Parker stayed!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
#10
#10
She did mess up Strickland by insisting she play point guard. Then turned around and berated the guards for their play, when it was really her fault that we had no point guard.(signs of the beginning of the end?) I do think McMahan would have been a good guard for us because she was smart and has true guard instincts.

Totally agree with the above - the great players never had the chemistry that was needed to be a great team. and like the cliche "when they were good they were... but when...

AND it was obvious that Parker would not stay for her fifth year. I wonder if any consideration was given to playing her in the NCAA's in March of her first year of enrollment?
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#11
#11
She did mess up Strickland by insisting she play point guard. Then turned around and berated the guards for their play, when it was really her fault that we had no point guard.(signs of the beginning of the end?) I do think McMahan would have been a good guard for us because she was smart and has true guard instincts.

Totally agree with the above - the great players never had the chemistry that was needed to be a great team. and like the cliche "when they were good they were... but when...

AND it was obvious that Parker would not stay for her fifth year. I wonder if any consideration was given to playing her in the NCAA's in March of her first year of enrollment?

Candace begged Pat to play her in the Final Four, she was physically ready to go. Pat didn't want to waste a year in the event she decided to stay. She kept the option open, which was a good thing considering. Had Candace played in 2005, Michigan State never would've come back from 16 down, and we would've beat Baylor for the NC.

Cait was one of the best guards in the country before her ACL injury. As was Avant before her car accident. Funny thing, Odyssey Sims wanted to come to Tennessee, but we had Avant and she looked elsewhere. Pat had no choice but to play Stricklen at PG, she was the only one suited for it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 3 people
#12
#12
Candace begged Pat to play her in the Final Four, she was physically ready to go. Pat didn't want to waste a year in the event she decided to stay. She kept the option open, which was a good thing considering. Had Candace played in 2005, Michigan State never would've come back from 16 down, and we would've beat Baylor for the NC.

Cait was one of the best guards in the country before her ACL injury. As was Avant before her car accident. Funny thing, Odyssey Sims wanted to come to Tennessee, but we had Avant and she looked elsewhere. Pat had no choice but to play Stricklen at PG, she was the only one suited for it.

I had heard Sims was a major Tenn lean back then! I have to say though had Avant been health she would have been an awesome pg for us. I'll neverrrrr forget how she played against Vandy her freshman year.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#13
#13
Despite tearing her Achilles after enrolling there, Avant ended up with a boatload of awards and accolades at Rhodes, was AA, and one of the three D-III finalists for POY.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#14
#14
I think it was Brewer who cut her Achilles tendon. Avant had allergies, pinched nerve in her hand, and concussions.
 
#15
#15
Avant was in a car accident during her senior year of HS and suffered a shoulder injury requiring surgery. At Tenn, she had allergy issues, a torn ligament in her thumb with CRPS, torn ligaments in her ankle, and several concussions. Then days after transferring to Rhodes, she tore her Achilles. She made a pretty good comeback. AFAIK, she's the only one of this group under discussion to have her jersey in the HOF in Knoxville.

Brewer reportedly had a cut Achilles from a broken candle holder.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#18
#18
Candace begged Pat to play her in the Final Four, she was physically ready to go. Pat didn't want to waste a year in the event she decided to stay. She kept the option open, which was a good thing considering. Had Candace played in 2005, Michigan State never would've come back from 16 down, and we would've beat Baylor for the NC.

Cait was one of the best guards in the country before her ACL injury. As was Avant before her car accident. Funny thing, Odyssey Sims wanted to come to Tennessee, but we had Avant and she looked elsewhere. Pat had no choice but to play Stricklen at PG, she was the only one suited for it.
but she really wasn't she became an adequate pg but not natural for her and it showed. She was the best option we had and that was the problem
 
#19
#19
New to the board but a long time supporter of the Lady Vols. I posted years ago during the Baby Vols' senior year Their pieces didn't fit. They were solid players and injuries probably kept them from winning a few more games, not to mention Pat's illness, but they just didn't have "it". Those were the UConn and Baylor years and the Lady Vols would have struggled to beat either even if healthy.

Stricken and Johnson were true talents, Baugh was solid but impaired by injury, BJorkland was a good shooter but couldn't create her own shot, Manning didn't really have a true position, and Bass was simply a role player who wasn't able to give much more than she did. Maybe if Cain and Brewer were physically and mentally there along with a true point guard, the FF would have been a strong possibility.
 
Last edited:

VN Store



Back
Top