Help w/ Plastics Manufacturing

#1

n_huffhines

What's it gonna cost?
Joined
Mar 11, 2009
Messages
84,513
Likes
50,025
#1
I have an idea for a product. I figure the best way to go about it is to 3d print a prototype and then have some manufacturers bid on production. I don't really know where to begin though (other than just blindly contacting some companies). Does anybody know a good designer who could help me get a prototype? Anybody know good plastics manufacturers?
 
#2
#2
I'd take some steps to make sure that your idea can't be stolen out from under you. People are dicks. Especially when money is involved.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#9
#9
Reached out to ORNL? We have quite the material sciences division. Can I ask what the use of your product is?
 
#11
#11
Thermoforming and working with material guage/thickness have many variables. The slightest deviation can have major cost ramifications when produced, especially the larger the production runs.

There is just thermoforming (actual bending and manipulating of raw material around simple mold), rotational molding( as it sounds material in and then spun into cavity walls ),vacuum forming (air pressure pulls material into wall cavity to mold), injection molding (as it sounds, injected material into cavity), and blow molding( literally inject tiny particulate and then blow air into material and form to cavity). Each application's tooling varies in cost in relation to the type of thermoforming, material, and quantity.

Mold design made with the right material. A quality mold is the most important factor. Heat/cool times are key.
What mold design will be best suited to produce given part?
What material will work best? Cost sensitivity in relation to material?
What are design requirements of finished part?
Will thermoforming require plugs (help pre-stretch raw material sheet and assist in forming, conform to cavity) and/or ring assists(help prevent webbing in multi cavity tool)?

wood molds- usually just low- low- low output and more so for sampling/prototyping before moving to actual production tooling mold

Plaster molds-don't even consider

Plastic molds-for more rapid forming cycles, using phenolic or epoxy resins. Do not conduct heat well so can't do rapid cooling- usually not used much/at all anymore

Aluminum- most common, casted, conducts heat well and cools quick allowing faster cycle time-- these are prevalent and more than likely what would be used for production

Mold design involves: Radii, draft angles, undercuts, and vacuum holes.

Tooling- can be very, very expensive, is a capital expenditure, determining the right quantity of cavities (greater output with more cavities and reduced trim scrap) (in relation to output production from machine time) and machinery used, also in relation to materials you decide to use.

What usually happens is you will have the manufacturer decide the best outlay of the mold, but, be aware of what you are doing and what your future is going to look like. We have made molds to produce an item, and they have ranged from a few thousand up to 150,000. What happens if your product takes off? You might have a 2 up, 4 up , or even 8 up die made initially, and it does well to meet demand. However, you were only producing say 20,000 units 2 times a year. Now, you need 100,000 to meet demand per run. The original tooling now requires more machine time from the manufacturer, and thus, your unit price will suffer. Sometimes you have to accept it, but, at what point does real money come into play? You might not reduce your unit cost with greater volume. You will be forced to evaluate your numbers and if it does well you will more than not have to produce another new tool/die at some point. As stated above, tooling can be a bear that absorbs so much time, effort, and money that you need to learn and become cognizant of actual costs to you.

Materials:
PET or PETE- polyethylene terephthalate
HDPE - high density polyethylene
LDPE- low density polythylene
PP- polypropylene
PVC- polyvinyl chloride

Start looking at all products made of plastic. Whether bottles, cookie trays, clamshells, bottle caps and then look up how they are made. It is an easy way to become familiar with materials and there common uses.


Machine time and scheduling- your enemy as a customer to any manufacturer. You have to understand the time and effort it takes for companies to look at projects. You are competing with current customers and needs and the time allowed for you to make your product on their time. They are driven by machine time and the cost analysis of profit into time.

Take no offense here with this, I don't know if you'll have a company or just approaching as an individual, but, be prepared to show you can pay for what you are looking at before some people will even talk to you. You will run into many people who will not even give you the time.

If you need anything I'll try and provide what help I can with anything you might have.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#14
#14
Once you have a prototype, the girlfriend can help with getting it sourced.

She's doing a similar project/start-up right now.
 
#15
#15
Once you have a prototype, the girlfriend can help with getting it sourced.

She's doing a similar project/start-up right now.

:good!:

I'm an ideas guy. I don't really want to build a company where I have to manage manufacturing and warehousing and shipping, etc. I'll do that, but I want to sell and get out and try the next idea so it's always fresh. That's kind of my ideal scenario. Getting contracts with retailers is what really ups the perceived value of the company/product, so help with that is awesome.
 
#16
#16
:good!:

I'm an ideas guy. I don't really want to build a company where I have to manage manufacturing and warehousing and shipping, etc. I'll do that, but I want to sell and get out and try the next idea so it's always fresh. That's kind of my ideal scenario. Getting contracts with retailers is what really ups the perceived value of the company/product, so help with that is awesome.

Unless you are lucky enough to get a licensing deal or directly buying the patent from the get-go, you will have to have some sort of proof of concept (selling your product). It would be at that point where sourcing would come in.
 
#17
#17
:good!:

I'm an ideas guy. I don't really want to build a company where I have to manage manufacturing and warehousing and shipping, etc. I'll do that, but I want to sell and get out and try the next idea so it's always fresh. That's kind of my ideal scenario. Getting contracts with retailers is what really ups the perceived value of the company/product, so help with that is awesome.

Take your mold and production to China and make bank. It's done by more companies you care to think.
 
#18
#18
Take your mold and production to China and make bank. It's done by more companies you care to think.

I get your point -the idea of going overseas-don't want to sound like an obtuse punk in regards to your statement-, but, wanted to edit this part in here for purpose of his situation. The tooling/mold would have to be made overseas unless ease of retro-fitting is doable and that would need to be known before sending it across the globe.

You have to ship it over there, and there is no guarantee it would work. It could require alot of hours ($$$$) to correct the problems to get the mold onto their machines and there is no guarantee it would work so now you are out your time, shipping costs, your tooling you paid to have made here, and more money and time to find out it can't be used. Now you have to get it sent back (more $) and it is no longer usable to you here anymore.

I do a lot of work in china and import production parts, paraffin wax, and components for customers. I would not recommend this (yet) for him. It can be extremely cheap, especially in terms of tooling costs which is nice.

It is a pain in the arse unless you know someone personally over there or are willing to travel yourself and find an auditing agency for help when you are not there.

It can be great, but, it can also put you out of business with 1 screw up too.

Remember, you are paying up front, pre payment on a part you will not see until it arrives. There is no invoicing. Duties, taxes, freight, getting it DDU to your door is good but you need someone to do the leg work for you to assure everything is correct before shipping.

Nothing worse than receiving a container from China you paid on, waiting 45-90 days on, and shows up and can't be used. You have no idea the pains you will experience when the issue hits, and good luck with any customer service and expedience in correcting the situation.
 
Last edited:
#19
#19
:good!:

I'm an ideas guy. I don't really want to build a company where I have to manage manufacturing and warehousing and shipping, etc. I'll do that, but I want to sell and get out and try the next idea so it's always fresh. That's kind of my ideal scenario. Getting contracts with retailers is what really ups the perceived value of the company/product, so help with that is awesome.

I would recommend you go to a local SCORE representative and talk with someone who has a background in manufacturing. SCORE is an awesome platform for small businesses and you can find some amazing people with great experiences, but more so, great successes from their past work.

There is usually someone within the group who will have an answer for any question you have. Best part, it's free and better, it never hurts to talk with retired executives and business people who had great success. Still guard your idea.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
#20
#20
:good!:

I'm an ideas guy. I don't really want to build a company where I have to manage manufacturing and warehousing and shipping, etc. I'll do that, but I want to sell and get out and try the next idea so it's always fresh. That's kind of my ideal scenario. Getting contracts with retailers is what really ups the perceived value of the company/product, so help with that is awesome.

Aren't you the one against intellectual property rights? Who is going to buy ideas from you if the ideas aren't protected?
 
Last edited:
#21
#21
I would recommend you go to a local SCORE representative and talk with someone who has a background in manufacturing. SCORE is an awesome platform for small businesses and you can find some amazing people with great experiences, but more so, great successes from their past work.

There is usually someone within the group who will have an answer for any question you have. Best part, it's free and better, it never hurts to talk with retired executives and business people who had great success. Still guard your idea.

that's excellent advice
 
#22
#22
I would recommend you go to a local SCORE representative and talk with someone who has a background in manufacturing. SCORE is an awesome platform for small businesses and you can find some amazing people with great experiences, but more so, great successes from their past work.

There is usually someone within the group who will have an answer for any question you have. Best part, it's free and better, it never hurts to talk with retired executives and business people who had great success. Still guard your idea.

Thank you for adding this to the discussion. I've never heard of SCORE. I have been toying around with a few ideas and this looks like a great resource. Many thanks!:hi:
 
#23
#23
Aren't you the one against intellectual property rights? Who is going to buy ideas from you if the ideas aren't protected?

I will patent my ish. I would never sue to enforce my patent but that doesn't mean it's not a good idea to have one, given the reality of the world I live in.
 
#25
#25
I will patent my ish. I would never sue to enforce my patent but that doesn't mean it's not a good idea to have one, given the reality of the world I live in.

So your views on the value of patents have changed now that you have an idea you want to sell?

http://www.volnation.com/forum/politics/206500-support-bill-stop-patent-trolls.html

"If I had it my way, patents wouldn't exist."

http://www.volnation.com/forum/politics/159176-official-libertarian-anarcho-capitalist-thread-8.html#post10999158

"Yes I oppose patent laws. In my experience, most people that support patent law have not fairly evaluated the costs and benefits of patents."

http://www.volnation.com/forum/politics/210988-bill-gates-microsoft-big-screw-patents.html#post9635567

"Plenty of money would be made in the absence of patents. Patents are anti-free market."
 

VN Store



Back
Top