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SamRebel35

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#1
I'm intrigued with this business of hotel flipping. What is your business model like for this? Have you been borrowing money for it? How do you handle the renovations and such? Do you get multiple projects going on at one time? How long is a flip on average? How do you find a buyer for a hotel? I have so many questions. Do you have any good reference material to advise (books, blogs, podcasts) for an aspiring real estate investor?
 
#2
#2
I'm intrigued with this business of hotel flipping. What is your business model like for this? Have you been borrowing money for it? How do you handle the renovations and such? Do you get multiple projects going on at one time? How long is a flip on average? How do you find a buyer for a hotel? I have so many questions. Do you have any good reference material to advise (books, blogs, podcasts) for an aspiring real estate investor?

What I look for are hotels in smaller towns/cities. I try to stay around 50,000 or less population wise and the fewer hotels in the area the better of course. I stay away from larger chain hotels and look for options that are maybe 25-60 rooms.

I don't borrow any money for any project I take on. I've been doing it a while so I have plenty of spendable cash to handle the project.

I have 3 crews who have worked for me for years now. They will go where the next project is and I myself and not a big part of the hands on renovation. Financing, planning, decisions, and final call on what each project will include is more less what I do. I hire/keep folks who know what they are doing so in the end it works out very well for all of us.

On average a 40 unit hotel will take us about 3 months top to bottom. It always depends on what each property really needs to turn the corner and bring it back to life. If you know what to look for, it can be very profitable. I've bought hotels that were closed for 60,000.00 and after putting another 60,000 into it sold it a month after the reno work for 295,000.

As for finding buyers I have several ways. I've sold properties on craigslist, loopnet, and various other sites. A lot of times I have buyers on standby. They know what I do and want in the hotel business so they tell me what they would like as far as room specifics, profit margins, location, and what they can afford and then I find something that I can flip and fit into what they are looking for. Win/win for both parties.

As for reference materials, not really. I got started by buying a duplex in Knoxville(my 1st home purchase) as I was going to live in one side and rent out the other. Live mortgage free was the idea. It worked out so I quickly thought why could I not do this but on a much larger scale. Hotels just seemed to fit for me. Once you have the start up capital to buy 1 or 2 and the money for renovation it's very easy IMO to be profitable doing it. I have flipped a total of 43 hotels in the last 5 years and the money gets better and better each time. You learn what to do and what not to do. Sometimes a certain area is looking for more of a budget place so you keep things very basic and simple. Other areas you have to spend more as the locals will pay more for those rooms.

It was always my plan to buy them, fix them up, and sell them quickly. About a year into it I realized sometimes the money is better if you take the property on yourself, staff it, and now it's always making you money. If a hotel can be operated by a staff of 5-6 people and brings in 170,000 a year while the cost to run it is closer to 100,000, why not hold onto it a bit and keep that 70,000 for yourself? I actually now own 8 hotels myself in various parts of the country that are separate from my flips. I saw a reason to keep them and keep the profits vs selling them quick. It's worked out great. Once I have had/ran them for 4-5 years, I then sell them once the "new" has worn off. IF they are very strong profit wise, I may decide to reinvest in renovating it again and do I all over. Each property is different. You have to be able to make decisions quickly and roll with the punches.
 
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#3
#3
What I look for are hotels in smaller towns/cities. I try to stay around 50,000 or less population wise and the fewer hotels in the area the better of course. I stay away from larger chain hotels and look for options that are maybe 25-60 rooms.

I don't borrow any money for any project I take on. I've been doing it a while so I have plenty of spendable cash to handle the project.

I have 3 crews who have worked for me for years now. They will go where the next project is and I myself and not a big part of the hands on renovation. Financing, planning, decisions, and final call on what each project will include is more less what I do. I hire/keep folks who know what they are doing so in the end it works out very well for all of us.

On average a 40 unit hotel will take us about 3 months top to bottom. It always depends on what each property really needs to turn the corner and bring it back to life. If you know what to look for, it can be very profitable. I've bought hotels that were closed for 60,000.00 and after putting another 60,000 into it sold it a month after the reno work for 295,000.

As for finding buyers I have several ways. I've sold properties on craigslist, loopnet, and various other sites. A lot of times I have buyers on standby. They know what I do and want in the hotel business so they tell me what they would like as far as room specifics, profit margins, location, and what they can afford and then I find something that I can flip and fit into what they are looking for. Win/win for both parties.

As for reference materials, not really. I got started by buying a duplex in Knoxville(my 1st home purchase) as I was going to live in one side and rent out the other. Live mortgage free was the idea. It worked out so I quickly thought why could I not do this but on a much larger scale. Hotels just seemed to fit for me. Once you have the start up capital to buy 1 or 2 and the money for renovation it's very easy IMO to be profitable doing it. I have flipped a total of 43 hotels in the last 5 years and the money gets better and better each time. You learn what to do and what not to do. Sometimes a certain area is looking for more of a budget place so you keep things very basic and simple. Other areas you have to spend more as the locals will pay more for those rooms.

It was always my plan to buy them, fix them up, and sell them quickly. About a year into it I realized sometimes the money is better if you take the property on yourself, staff it, and now it's always making you money. If a hotel can be operated by a staff of 5-6 people and brings in 170,000 a year while the cost to run it is closer to 100,000, why not hold onto it a bit and keep that 70,000 for yourself? I actually now own 8 hotels myself in various parts of the country that are separate from my flips. I saw a reason to keep them and keep the profits vs selling them quick. It's worked out great. Once I have had/ran them for 4-5 years, I then sell them once the "new" has worn off. IF they are very strong profit wise, I may decide to reinvest in renovating it again and do I all over. Each property is different. You have to be able to make decisions quickly and roll with the punches.

Wow, this is amazing! Thanks for your answers. The duplex idea is something that me and the wife have talked about a lot. Additionally, I've been wanting to flip some small and inexpensive foreclosure houses with all cash. Just scary to see all that money in my account and then imagine it not being there in one fell swoop. I've never done anything like it before, and I don't know a ton about home renovation. When you were starting out, how did you vet contractors? I would be afraid they would take me for a ride and I wouldn't know any better.
 
#4
#4
Wow, this is amazing! Thanks for your answers. The duplex idea is something that me and the wife have talked about a lot. Additionally, I've been wanting to flip some small and inexpensive foreclosure houses with all cash. Just scary to see all that money in my account and then imagine it not being there in one fell swoop. I've never done anything like it before, and I don't know a ton about home renovation. When you were starting out, how did you vet contractors? I would be afraid they would take me for a ride and I wouldn't know any better.

Most folks on here laughed when I mentioned what a lot of my workforce is. About half of the people who work for me are amish or ex amish. I get great quality work, and they are about as honest as you will find. When I decide to staff a hotel and keep it more often than not the people I put in place to run it are ex amish and I can not only staff the place but the husband/wife run it, the son does the maintenance, and the daughters run the office/do housekeeping. People laugh, but it works.

Best advice I can give you is to just start with 1. Don't try and get multiple projects going early on. It would be way too much for you to handle. Way too many things come up when you 1st start out. ALWAYS be selective on the area you buy in. Always pay attention to other listings and how many are sitting vacant. Don't ever go crazy on a renovation making it way over the top. Build to the area and sell it quick. Any cash profit is just money in the bank to start the next one.
 
#5
#5
Most folks on here laughed when I mentioned what a lot of my workforce is. About half of the people who work for me are amish or ex amish. I get great quality work, and they are about as honest as you will find. When I decide to staff a hotel and keep it more often than not the people I put in place to run it are ex amish and I can not only staff the place but the husband/wife run it, the son does the maintenance, and the daughters run the office/do housekeeping. People laugh, but it works.

Best advice I can give you is to just start with 1. Don't try and get multiple projects going early on. It would be way too much for you to handle. Way too many things come up when you 1st start out. ALWAYS be selective on the area you buy in. Always pay attention to other listings and how many are sitting vacant. Don't ever go crazy on a renovation making it way over the top. Build to the area and sell it quick. Any cash profit is just money in the bank to start the next one.

Lol. Not sure how many Amish folks I could find in Atlanta.

Yes, I've always heard that you make your money on a property when you purchase it. Makes a lot of sense. Make sure you get a steal of a deal (easier said than done obviously) in a neighborhood that has comps such that when you're done renovating, there's some good meat on the bone. Sounds very simple in theory, but I keep getting analysis paralysis thining about all of the variables that I don't know how to compensate for.

Thanks for your input. If you want a place to keep as sort of an updated journal of what is going on with your business, this thread might be a good place to do it. Would love hearing how your business keeps evolving.
 
#6
#6
Most folks on here laughed when I mentioned what a lot of my workforce is. About half of the people who work for me are amish or ex amish. I get great quality work, and they are about as honest as you will find. When I decide to staff a hotel and keep it more often than not the people I put in place to run it are ex amish and I can not only staff the place but the husband/wife run it, the son does the maintenance, and the daughters run the office/do housekeeping. People laugh, but it works.

Best advice I can give you is to just start with 1. Don't try and get multiple projects going early on. It would be way too much for you to handle. Way too many things come up when you 1st start out. ALWAYS be selective on the area you buy in. Always pay attention to other listings and how many are sitting vacant. Don't ever go crazy on a renovation making it way over the top. Build to the area and sell it quick. Any cash profit is just money in the bank to start the next one.

Very well played on several fronts - I don't subscribe to your recruiting number theories - but applaud your business model and acumen. Rather than funny, the Amish workers is imho brilliant both because of the quality of their work and their not being averse to actually working :) You also appear to be somewhat mirroring the Indian run and managed hotels with your husband and wife model. How many of your sales are to Indian customers if you don't mind my asking?
 
#7
#7
Very well played on several fronts - I don't subscribe to your recruiting number theories - but applaud your business model and acumen. Rather than funny, the Amish workers is imho brilliant both because of the quality of their work and their not being averse to actually working :) You also appear to be somewhat mirroring the Indian run and managed hotels with your husband and wife model. How many of your sales are to Indian customers if you don't mind my asking?

If being honest, zero.

Most want to purchase on contract and that is something I don't do. If I sell a property it's all cash all up front. While I don't want it to sound bad I would also never employ an Indian family to run a hotel I own. They are notorious for letting hotel properties go and not keeping them up. Most try and purchase one on a land contract deal with little down and then 2-3 years later they take any profits and just walk. You would be left with a run down property and it would be a nightmare to try and find them to deal with them in the court system.
 

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