are the terrorists winning

#1
J

joevol320

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#1
i was listening to a radio show and the guy was talking about how most of America suffers whenever there is a failed attempt at blowing up a plane.

We react by putting more airline security procedures on millions Americans because of failed attempts by a handfull of whackos. millions of Americans suffer because of political correctness. This has to tip the scales in favor of terrorists.
 
#2
#2
I would agree, the terrorists are winning mainly because we are not fighting back. They are at war with us but we are not at war with them.

Our problem with all of this is we are always on defense instead of being on offense. We always react to what the terrorists are doing, they are always a step ahead of the U.S.
And then the authorities put these idiotic policies in place that make it a pain to travel and are not very effective.
 
#3
#3
We're on the offense now. Obama's administration has devised the following anti-terrorist strategy.

One hour before landing you can no longer do the following -

1. Have a pillow behind your head.

2. Have a blanket or book in your lap.

3. Go to the bathroom.
 
#4
#4
The terrorist are winning because we are not fighting a war. We haven't fought a real war since Korea.
 
#5
#5
As MontereyVol said, the terrorists are only winning for the moment because Americans have not yet fully committed themselves to the fray. Very few of us have so far. Most are too busy with their iPhones, Wii, HDTV, Vibe, etc, to pay it no nevermind. Just like most injustices, little attention is paid unless the likelihood of the injustice affecting the majority becomes high. Oh, but then, look out!!!
 
#6
#6
A lot of Americans do not see this as a problem, until it personally affects them.

Which alludes to what JP said.
 
#10
#10
Basically we can win 99% of the battles and if the terrorists are successful one time everyone considers it a losing proposition. There will be American casualties in this war and we wont lose too many battles. I don't see how it ends. They hate us, we can't change that. We have basically kicked their ass by killing thousands of their base and some of their leaders, but this goes mostly unnoticed.

The tribuanls were brilliant, however they should have moved more swiftly and executed them prior to BHO's election. If I'm not mistaken two planners in the recent plot were released from Gitmo (during Bush's term, probably because of pressure).

One more point I want to throw out there. The guy from Yemen, after trying to blow up the plane in Detroit, gets treated in a Detroit hospital, then prior to his interrogation, some FB1 agent says: (note, a translator interprets the following in the terrorists native tongue)

Sir, you have the right to remain silent, anything you say can and will be used against you in court. You have the right to an attorney and to have your attorney with you during questioning if you wish one. Sir (here is the ass kicker), if you cannot afford to hire an attorney you may have one appointed to represent you (at the tax payer's costs). If you decide to answer questions now without an attorney present you may stop answering at any time until you speak to your attorney.

This guy is from Nigeria and has been trained by Al queda. Does anyone think that this questioning tactic will yield any fruitful information? Puhleeese.
 
#11
#11
RockyTopVol said:
We're on the offense now. Obama's administration has devised the following anti-terrorist strategy.

One hour before landing you can no longer do the following -

1. Have a pillow behind your head.

2. Have a blanket or book in your lap.

3. Go to the bathroom.
Click to expand...

Obama’s plan:

Step 1: Sing Kumbaya

Step 2: There is no Step 2 because Step 1 never fails

Obama’s Shameful Handling of National Security Issues.

Obambi made a bigger deal out of the Harvard 'professor' being arrested than he has this 'isolated' incident.

By saying this was an 'isolated incident' he reveals that he either dumber than a box of rocks or he is diliberatly lying to cover for the enemy and/or lying to cover for the studied ineptness of of this administration.

Napolitano and Hitlary Clinton should both resign immediately, there is no excuse for such pitiful porformance of duty.



Oldvol75 said:
I'm at war. But my government won't help me.
Click to expand...

And it was they who declared war on us!

One thing everyone should understand about islamic tactics.
 
#12
#12
The problem we are having is simple, we are not fighting in conventional warfare, our military philosophy is built upon the conventional warfare model. When we fight against conventional armies we usually win. Our military is being pitted against a force that does not stand and fight.
 
#13
#13
KB5252 said:
The problem we are having is simple, we are not fighting in conventional warfare, our military philosophy is built upon the conventional warfare model. When we fight against conventional armies we usually win. Our military is being pitted against a force that does not stand and fight.
Click to expand...

I agree with some of this, but our military, is diverse enough to make adjustments to the type of fighting that it takes. And they have in some cases.

Being PC, is crippling the effort, both here, and abroad.
 
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#14
#14
BeecherVol said:
I agree with some of this, but our military, is diverse enough to make adjustments to the typing of fighting that it takes. And they have in some cases.

Being PC, is crippling the effort, both here, and abroad.
Click to expand...

My point is that our military is incapable of fighting terrorists who only surface to blow themselves up or detonate an explosive device aimed at killing them (the military) or civilians.

In Afghanistan the situation is a little different than it is in Iraq. In Afghan there are battles to be fought and won. Afghans have a long history of conducting guerrilla warfare, this is where a change in strategy is productive and a war can be fought and won, these are usually battles of attrition though, you must wear down the enemies resources, resolve and limit the safe harbors they enjoy and need to continue operations.

The terrorists tactics used by the Palestinians and other terrorists are much harder (if not impossible) to fight with a conventional military force, for example see the Israeli military and their struggles with the Palestinians.
 
#18
#18
"Are the terrorists winning?"

Well, if you ask the government, then yes they are winning. But, fear not, government has your best interest in mind! The government is at work right now drawing out plans to make airports even safer! Upcoming safety provisions include the ban of make-up powders, ink pens, laptops, and all jewelry!

Seriously, though, I could see make up powders getting banned from airplanes in the near future.
 
#19
#19
KB5252 said:
My point is that our military is incapable of fighting terrorists who only surface to blow themselves up or detonate an explosive device aimed at killing them (the military) or civilians.

In Afghanistan the situation is a little different than it is in Iraq. In Afghan there are battles to be fought and won. Afghans have a long history of conducting guerrilla warfare, this is where a change in strategy is productive and a war can be fought and won, these are usually battles of attrition though, you must wear down the enemies resources, resolve and limit the safe harbors they enjoy and need to continue operations.

The terrorists tactics used by the Palestinians and other terrorists are much harder (if not impossible) to fight with a conventional military force, for example see the Israeli military and their struggles with the Palestinians.
Click to expand...

We are not fighting any of these in the conventional sense. We are setting ourselves up for a win but the ROE's are not allowing us to.

Rumsfeld had it right and we went to smaller forces that move and think on their own to fight this type of battle, however it only works when you can actively implement it.
 
#20
#20
The terrorists are also winning here in the U.S. not just overseas. There are terrorist cells i.e. training camps, organizations etc etc right in our own back yard and the gov't can not do anything to them because they are technically not breaking any laws. (have heard of one of these cells located in GA...)

No matter how many times the Military or gov't breaks up a cell or group or kills a prominent leader there will ALWAYS be another that crops up. They are winning because in many ways we are fighting an invisible force. They live among us and are often not detected until it's too late.

It's like killing a cockroach. Where there is one...there are more. They will not stop because they believe that their holy mission is to destroy every single American and what America stands for.
 
#21
#21
Tough day today in Afghanistan. It's thought that the CIA lost 8 employees in one suicide bomber attack and another attack killed 5 Canadians.
 
#22
#22
MontereyVol said:
We are not fighting any of these in the conventional sense. We are setting ourselves up for a win but the ROE's are not allowing us to.

Rumsfeld had it right and we went to smaller forces that move and think on their own to fight this type of battle, however it only works when you can actively implement it.
Click to expand...

Obama's ROEs are reprehensable, Karzai constantly complains about civilian casualties but the enemy is essentially civilian, they don't exactly wear uniforms and the keep their families with them.

Screw Karzai, Screw Afghanistan, Screw Obama, bring our troops home, Yemen poses a much better threat as an al-qaeda trainging ground.

Meanwhile back at the ranch house.

There has been a 300 percent increase in assaults on agents in the first two months of this fiscal year (October and November) compared to last year — 108 compared to 27 in the Tucson Sector.
Click to expand...

VolGal423 said:
The terrorists are also winning here in the U.S. not just overseas. There are terrorist cells i.e. training camps, organizations etc etc right in our own back yard and the gov't can not do anything to them because they are technically not breaking any laws. (have heard of one of these cells located in GA...)

No matter how many times the Military or gov't breaks up a cell or group or kills a prominent leader there will ALWAYS be another that crops up. They are winning because in many ways we are fighting an invisible force. They live among us and are often not detected until it's too late.

It's like killing a cockroach. Where there is one...there are more. They will not stop because they believe that their holy mission is to destroy every single American and what America stands for.
Click to expand...

Those silly cockroaches, when will they ever learn? :)

TennTradition said:
Tough day today in Afghanistan. It's thought that the CIA lost 8 employees in one suicide bomber attack and another attack killed 5 Canadians.
Click to expand...

Mohamed was a liar and a sham.


Over a billion people live in nations controlled by Islamic principles. Thus to many, Muhammad was a rousing success.

Yet these very same nations are among the world's most destitute, least free, and most violent. And they are the fountain of terror, providing the money, men, motive, and means for murder.

In that light, Muhammad’s legacy is considerably more tarnished.
Click to expand...

Even more so if you read the rest of the well informed article.
 
#23
#23
Volunteer_Kirby said:
"Are the terrorists winning?"

Well, if you ask the government, then yes they are winning. But, fear not, government has your best interest in mind! The government is at work right now drawing out plans to make airports even safer! Upcoming safety provisions include the ban of make-up powders, ink pens, laptops, and all jewelry!

Seriously, though, I could see make up powders getting banned from airplanes in the near future.
Click to expand...

that's my point. every american that flys will have to adjust because of what one person attempted to do.

what will have to be changed again if another attempt is made? it's going to be just a matter of time before someone lucks up. then what will happend, ban all flying? ban all luggage?
 
#24
#24
gsvol said:
Obama's ROEs are reprehensable, Karzai constantly complains about civilian casualties but the enemy is essentially civilian, they don't exactly wear uniforms and the keep their families with them.

Screw Karzai, Screw Afghanistan, Screw Obama, bring our troops home, Yemen poses a much better threat as an al-qaeda trainging ground.
Click to expand...

Those ROE's were in place before Obama, and even Bush II. They were formed, I believe right around the time I joined and they evolved into the most prohibitive rule set ever devised for warfare.

Not all blame falls on Obama.
 
#25
#25
MontereyVol said:
We are not fighting any of these in the conventional sense. We are setting ourselves up for a win but the ROE's are not allowing us to.

Rumsfeld had it right and we went to smaller forces that move and think on their own to fight this type of battle, however it only works when you can actively implement it.
Click to expand...

I'll certainly defer to you in these matters, I was only trying to point out that large forces are not as effective confronting an enemy who prefers to hide among the population and strike via explosives and using hit and run tactics.

As for the part in bold what specifically need to change for us to be successful IYO? Do you see any reason to believe they will address the problem and move forward?

I agree that smaller more specialized and well trained units are certainly more effective in confronting an enemy like we see in Afghan. We learned how much more effective units like these can be in Vietnam, our LRRP's were essential in gathering intelligence and harassing their supply corridors. I have always enjoyed reading about those men and their experiences from Vietnam.
 
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