More questions regarding our involvement in Libya

#1

utgibbs

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#1
It is clear our involvement in the no-fly zone was a hastily stitched together policy - probably coming from the "liberal imperialist" wing of the Obama Administration - with no real plan or endgame, and, in fact, seemingly now led by a Bernard-Henri Levy, a somewhat colorful "philosopher" in French circles, with the deeply unpopular Sarkozy riding on the coattails.

However, thanks to Wikileaks, we know exactly what kind of "hotbed" is Benghazi and the East - straight from our own State Department.

http://213.251.145.96/cable/2008/02/08TRIPOLI120.html

The first paragraph should be enough to set the stage. Regardless, the area certainly contains some of the most anti-American and jihadist elements in all of Libya.

Do we even know who we are supporting? (as I admitted at the beginning, I did not know who they were although I suspected [now confirmed] they lacked the political infrastructure and competence to run the Libyan government) The likely answer is "No," certainly not at the time the policy was hatched. We may be catching up now.

I think Qaddafi has said he was fighting "Al Qa'ida" in the East.

Could the Qolonel be right???????????????????? This certainly wouldn't be the first time in American interventionist policy we've wound up propping up a future enemy.....
 
#2
#2
As often is the case, Mark Steyn has it right.

http://www.ocregister.com/opinion/military-293677-gadhafi-way.html

And certainly every attempt the president makes to explain his Libyan adventure is either cringe-makingly stupid ("I'm accustomed to this contradiction of being both a commander-in-chief but also somebody who aspires to peace") or alarmingly revealing of a very peculiar worldview:
"That's why building this international coalition has been so important," he said the other day. "It is our military that is being volunteered by others to carry out missions that are important not only to us, but are important internationally."

Hadn't heard that last quote by Obama but holy crap that's a doozy. Others can volunteer our military for missions? (except Congress of course)
 
#3
#3
You don't need wikileaks to get that info.

I've already posted on this a couple of times.

Our own analysis of al-qaeda documents shows that a high percentage of the fighters in Iraq came from NE Libya.

BTW, it seems the Obama admin is thinking of trying to bypass the Libyan arms embargo to send arms to these al-qaeda friendly Libyan rebels.

A Big Pot of Gold in Libya Could Finance Gadhafi's Long War | Oil Price.com

As it has turned out, the 'long war' threat from Gadhafi may not be as emply as some might think.
------------------------

Libya's gold reserves, ranked No. 23 in the world, ahead of Saudi Arabia, as of December 2009 (see table above), are worth around $6.5 billion at current prices, enough to finance Gadhafi's defense against opposition and international forces for quite a while, to say the least.

Furthermore, Gadhafi may have some other assets stashed in 'untraceable' places.
 
#4
#4
You don't need wikileaks to get that info.

I've already posted on this a couple of times.

Our own analysis of al-qaeda documents shows that a high percentage of the fighters in Iraq came from NE Libya.

BTW, it seems the Obama admin is thinking of trying to bypass the Libyan arms embargo to send arms to these al-qaeda friendly Libyan rebels.

A Big Pot of Gold in Libya Could Finance Gadhafi's Long War | Oil Price.com

Al Qaeda does not have a franchise in Libya. The Al Qaeda franchises are AQI, AQAP, and AQIM. Are there other militant Islamic organizations in Libya? Yes. Do they want to be enfrachised by AQ? Maybe. Are they actually part of AQ? No.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#6
#6
The double-standard Obama has for himself is nauseating, at this point.

that's ok, his willing accomplices in the media are wildly spinning away the double-standards. Why else are there no anti-war rallies descending on The Mall in DC?
 
#7
#7
that's ok, his willing accomplices in the media are wildly spinning away the double-standards. Why else are there no anti-war rallies descending on The Mall in DC?

You have to wonder. I wonder what Monday's address will entail..
 
#9
#9
The rebels are pushing westward again and have taken a few strategic cities, now.
 
#10
#10
When we look at the record of "liberal imperialism" in the latter half of the 20th century, three stand out:

1. Vietnam invasion of Cambodia to oust the Khmer Rouge
2. Cuba in Angola to rout South African fascists and secure the legitimate government of the MPLA
3. Tanzania ousting Idi Amin in Uganda

Where was the US? On the wrong side of history in each conflict - embarassingly so. In fact, our continued propping up of Apartheid South Africa and the illegitimate Savimbi UNITA wrecked Angola. The petrified Cold War doublethink had to side with Pol Pot as an ally of China vice Vietnam, the ally of the USSR.

It would not surprise me one iota if the elements in Libya do not harbor Al Qa'ida or invite them into the country should they seize power. And if they do, we can expect a NATO / US presence to secure the government.
 
#13
#13
Al Qaeda does not have a franchise in Libya. The Al Qaeda franchises are AQI, AQAP, and AQIM. Are there other militant Islamic organizations in Libya? Yes. Do they want to be enfrachised by AQ? Maybe. Are they actually part of AQ? No.
Posted via VolNation Mobile

As usual you are dead wrong.

You are so often so far wrong that one wonders if you are not indulging in purposeful purveyance of deception.

Al-qaeda in Iraq's own captured documents prove that Libay was the highest per capita contributor to al-qaeda in Iraq's fighting force, second only in numbers to Saudi Arabia.

At any rate there is plenty of cross polination among al-qaeda and the other groups you mention and they all fall under the unbrella of the muslim brotherhood, all with the common goal of establishing governments that abide under the rule of sharia law which eventually should be world wide in scope and all under the rule of one caliphate.
 
#14
#14
As usual you are dead wrong.
No.
Al-qaeda in Iraq's own captured documents prove that Libay was the highest per capita contributor to al-qaeda in Iraq's fighting force, second only in numbers to Saudi Arabia.
This in no way establishes that there is a franchise in Libya. Like I stated earlier, there exists AQ, AQI, AQAP, and AQIM. That is it. Others are not formally part of AQ.
 
#15
#15
You are so often so far wrong that one wonders if you are not indulging in purposeful purveyance of deception.

You busted him. He's a deep sleeper plant from those evil muslims, embedded in the heart of volnation. His mission is to spread propaganda to the extremely nationally influential Tennessee fan base.

Your book deal will be enormous.
 
#16
#16
You busted him. He's a deep sleeper plant from those evil muslims, embedded in the heart of volnation. His mission is to spread propaganda to the extremely nationally influential Tennessee fan base.

Your book deal will be enormous.

makes you wonder why he's never taken on utgibbs with the same kind of single-minded ferocity. Just plays in to the theory that gsvol and gibbs are the same person on varying degrees of medication.
 
#17
#17
makes you wonder why he's never taken on utgibbs with the same kind of single-minded ferocity. Just plays in to the theory that gsvol and gibbs are the same person on varying degrees of medication.

notice the only time they've debated eachother is when others asked why it never happened?
 
#22
#22
The devolution of this thread shows a quiet desperation of some members of the board.
 
#23
#23
As usual you are dead wrong.

You are so often so far wrong that one wonders if you are not indulging in purposeful purveyance of deception.

Al-qaeda in Iraq's own captured documents prove that Libay was the highest per capita contributor to al-qaeda in Iraq's fighting force, second only in numbers to Saudi Arabia.

At any rate there is plenty of cross polination among al-qaeda and the other groups you mention and they all fall under the unbrella of the muslim brotherhood, all with the common goal of establishing governments that abide under the rule of sharia law which eventually should be world wide in scope and all under the rule of one caliphate.

Latest on al Qaeda's presence in Libya:

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Intelligence on the rebel forces battling Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi has shown "flickers" of al Qaeda or Hezbollah presence but there is still no detailed picture of the emerging opposition, NATO's top operations commander said on Tuesday.
"We are examining very closely the content, composition, the personalities, who are the leaders of these opposition forces," Admiral James Stavridis, NATO's supreme allied commander for Europe and also commander of U.S. European Command, said during testimony at the U.S. Senate.
Gaddafi's troops on Tuesday reversed the westward charge of rebel forces as world powers met in London more than a week after the United States and other nations launched a military campaign aimed at protecting Libyan civilians.
While Stavridis said the opposition's leadership appeared to be "responsible men and women" fighting Gaddafi, he said that "we have seen flickers in the intelligence of potential al Qaeda, Hezbollah. We've seen different things."
"But at this point I don't have detail sufficient to say there is a significant al Qaeda presence or any other terrorist presence," he said.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/libya-intelligence-shows-flickers-al-qaeda-u-20110329-074729-524.html

Of course, I would imagine that you, through trolling the blogosphere, have much more intel on both Libya and AQ than does Adm. Stravridis.
 
#24
#24
The devolution of this thread shows a quiet desperation of some members of the board.

Does that answer your questions about Libya??

Cost of the war, week I; $600 million.

Brian Koenig Official Website

The Pentagon announced that the military costs
of intervention in Libya have topped $600 million.
Here are some of the expenses:

- 191 Tomahawk cruise missiles: $269 million

- 455 precision guided bombs: tens of thousands
of dollars per bomb

- A downed Air Force F-15E: $60 million

HQ U.S. Joint Forces Command, is being disestablished
ostensibly to save about $500M. Somewhere in a few
of those Tomahawks went all 1,900 lost jobs in
Hampton Roads, Virginia.





Al Qaeda does not have a franchise in Libya. The Al Qaeda franchises are AQI, AQAP, and AQIM. Are there other militant Islamic organizations in Libya? Yes. Do they want to be enfrachised by AQ? Maybe. Are they actually part of AQ? No.
Posted via VolNation Mobile

You say al Qaeda doesn't have a franchise in Libya
and you list al Qaeda franchises in Libya.

Strange.

Al Hasadi, who has declared himself the Emir of the
Islamic Emirate of Libya was an al Qaeda operative
in Pakistan and arrested by the Pakistanis in 2002
and turned over to the Americans in Afghanistan.

Under our catch and release program he was returned
to Libya where al Quackdaffy arrested and held him
until 2008 at which time he returned to eastern Libya
and began recruiting for al Qaeda in Iraq and was quite
successful in that his home town became far and away
the highest per capita contributor to the al Qaeda
fighting force in Iraq, including suicide bombers.





Wonder what happens when the rebels start killing citizens loyal to Col. Q? Guess we'll have to protect them too...

Most definately, just like we protected Serbians who
were victims of agression from the mujahedeen.




You busted him. He's a deep sleeper plant from those evil muslims, embedded in the heart of volnation. His mission is to spread propaganda to the extremely nationally influential Tennessee fan base.

Your book deal will be enormous.


I'm asking for a $200,000 advance, do you think
that's enough??

On another message board under a discussion
about a UPI report that Osama bin Laden is
actively moving about the Hindu Kush of
northeastern Afghanistan and Northwestern
Pakistan, perhaps in preparation for a major
offensive the following post was made from
a poster who evidently has intimate personal
knowledge of the conflict in that area"

"Bin Laden considers the Korengal Vally in the
Hindu Kush of north east Afghanistan his home
territory. It was there he trained his 9-11 gang.

It was there the Seal Team was sent in to get
him - BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE HE HEADQUARTERED.
(Unfortunately, that mission turned disastrous.)

Then we sent in troops to establish KOPs and
firebases. We sent in the 173rd AIRBORNE - who
drove bin out and kept the Taliban at bay and
denied them an easy back and forth from Pakistan
to Afghanistan through the porous mountain range.

The troops not only had almost daily firefights with
the enemy but fought on some of the most hostile
terrain in the world. They brought the Taliban to a
standstill there. (The only living soldier awarded t
he MOH since ‘nam, was one of Sky Soldiers. The
documentary of one the platoons in that valley,
the one who saw the most fighting in the most
remote of firebases, was up for an Oscar.)

And then came our new so-called CIC and his
new ROE - that tied our soldiers hands behind
them and gave the advantage to the Taliban.
Our number of KIA’s DOUBLED every month from
the corresponding month of the previous year...
because of those new ROE. And suddenly, the
media was silent on the deaths of our troops.

And THEN, the administration pulled our troops
OUT - not because the Taliban were winning -
just pulled them out. AND made a deal with the
Taliban, basically: “We’re pulling out. If you
don’t fire on us while pulling out, we’ll leave
you the ammo, thousands of gallons of gas,
etc.” that was the deal they made, instead
of: “We’re pulling out. One bullet comes out
way, we’ll pulverize the valley back to a gravel
pit. Got it!” (That’s the difference between a
REAL Commander in Chief and a Community
Organizer - who also favors Muslims over
Americans.)

The media was then very quiet on their decision
to hand the Hindu Kush area - Bin’s area - back
to him. When people did get wind of it, they lied.
But Al Jazeera also made a video, that tells the
truth - and yes, it IS the very base they pulled
out of. The hooches the guys made - the whole
fire base - is totally identifiable.

If you want to know/see the truth of why Bin
now walks the valley again, watch the videos.

And now he’s helping the Al Qaeda ‘rebels’ in
Lybia. He and his henchmen are vague on who
the ‘rebels are...’not really sure’ they say. The
truth is coming to light. If it falls in on them
they can say “We had not way of knowing.”

Watch the videos and know why binny has his
valley back. the question is: Can you handle
the truth?

al Jazeera video

YouTube - Taliban Take Over Former U.S. Base in Korengal Valley

Our guys in the Korengal

Home — RESTREPO — A Film by Sebastian Junger & Tim Hetherington

and now our muslim lover is helping al Qaeda
take over Lybia."

0326mckeetoon.jpg
 

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