The Ground Zero mosque is a bad idea and shouldn't be permitted.

[gsvol]

Pajamas Media Barry Goldwater and the Ground Zero Mosque

If there is one politico-religious movement that understands the use of symbols to advance its claims, it is Islam. No, I am not speaking of radical Islam. I am speaking of Islam.

The Ground Zero mosque is the manipulation of symbols. The very name “Cordoba Initiative” is an insult to the people of Spain, a reminder of their conquest by Islam and the creation of a society organized through the sharia concept of dhimmitude, a society that puts non-Muslims in the role of second-class citizens.
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From the time of its inception, Islam has celebrated its victories by building mosques on the holy sites of the people it conquered. The al-Aqsa mosque looks down on the Wailing Wall of Israel’s sacred Temple. The insult is underscored by the denial of the existence of the Temple. The Hagia Sophia in Istanbul was converted into a mosque, and the original Cordoba mosque was built over the site of a Christian cathedral.

The Koran (018.021) exhorts Muslims to build mosques on the places of worship of the people they conquer so as to symbolically affirm Islam’s victory.

If the Ground Zero mosque were indeed an attempt at creating reconciliation, the developers of the mosque would be willing to sit down with New York Governor David Paterson and discuss alternative sites.

No alternative site will do because no alternative site will symbolize the destruction of the World Trade Center as a victory of Islam.

No alternative site will cast a shadow over the tragedy of Ground Zero and transform it into a propaganda victory for Islam. The recent revelation that the Ground Zero mosque developers won’t rule out accepting Saudi and Iranian money underscores the true intentions of the developers.

 

[T-TownVol]

Any one that thinks this is not about a monument to the Muslim triumph over American capitalism, is blind or just not very well read.

 

[gsvol]

Any one that thinks this is not about a monument to the Muslim triumph over American capitalism, is blind or just not very well read.

Six Meat Buffet Blog Archive A Mosque On Every Corner And A Chicken In Every Roost

Feisel Abdul Rauf:

Defending wahhabism – a puritanical version of Islam that governs Saudi Arabia.

Calling for the elimination of Israel by claiming a one-nation state, meaning no more Jewish State.

Defending Bin Laden’s violence.

There is a lot more to this man than merely a cleric.

9/11 Mosque Imam Wrote Much of the Guts of Obama's Historic Cairo Speech!

The Shoebat Foundation obtained this shocking audio recording of Rauf's own voice boasting in Arabic that Obama’s historic Cairo speech was provided by the Imam and the Cordova Initiative in what the Imam called “The Blue Print” which he said was the solution to the Islamic-American divide. Rauf claimed Chapter 6 of the Imam’s work engineered by the Cordova Initiative was the construct for the entire speech:
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For an Imam in New York to be involved in the orchestrating U.S. foreign policy is quite the claim. In the recording dated February 5th, 2010 Rauf boasted that:
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We have an analytical approach. Our work has been that. IN THE BOOK CHAPTER 6, I WROTE ABOUT THIS BLUE PRINT as to WHAT HAS TO BE DONE BY THE U.S. GOVERNMENT, what has to be done by the Jewish community, what has to be done by the Christian community, what has to be done by the Muslim community, what has to be done by educators, what has to be done by the media. For example, IN MY BOOK IN THE ARABIC VERSION page 293, what did I write? WHAT ARE THE THINGS THAT THE UNITED STATES NEEDS TO DO. IF YOU EXAMINE THIS CHAPTER YOU WILL FIND THAT THE OBAMA SPEECH IN CAIRO WAS ALL TAKEN FROM THIS SECTION .
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The story was even collaborated in a written article in an interview with Hani Al-Waziri of Egypt. The clue was revealed while Rauf was answering a question regarding President Barack Obama’s speech in which Rauf replied:

“The speech was wonderful and wise in his choice of words, the Prime Minister of Malaysia after the speech disclosed to me that it is now easy for any president of a Muslim country to establish good relations with America, and I AM NOT GOING TO HIDE FROM YOU THAT ONE OF THOSE WHO PARTICIPATED IN WRITING THE SPEECH, TRANSFERRED ENTIRE PARTS OF MY BOOK ‘A NEW VISION FOR MUSLIMS AND THE WEST’, which he referred to U.S. interests being compatible with top interests of the Muslim world”.

Rauf did not disclose the name of this speechwriter that included Rauf’s work in president Obama’s historic address to the Muslim world. It is crucial to note that the Arabic version of Feisal Abdul Rauf’s book was published in Malaysia titled “A CALL TO PRAYER, FROM THE WORLD TRADE CENTER RUBBLE: ISLAMIC DAWA (SUMMONS TO ISLAM) IN THE HEART OF AMERICA POST-9/11."
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Rauf boasted about his towering structure by Ground Zero as:

“an icon that will make Muslims proud, not only locally but globally.”

His suggestion to Muslims on how to deal with western Christians and Jews was:

“deal with them as one courts a pretty girl he wants to date; stop thinking like a typical Muslim. Then you can engage.”

He also discussed how he courted Bloomberg and the Jewish Community boards that “we have inroads with the Jewish Community Center”. It is interesting that Rauf stated in Arabic to Hadielislam, another prominent Muslim think tank that:

“people need to use peaceful means to advise the governors and government institutions…we also suggest to the governors and political institutions to CONSULT [MUSLIM] RELIGIOUS INSTITUTIONS AND [MUSLIM] PERSONALITIES IN THE FIELD SO AS TO ASSURE THEIR DECISION MAKING TO REFLECT THE SPIRIT OF SHARIAH.”

In previous reports researched by the Walid Shoebat Foundation, it was revealed that Imam Rauf has made statements in the Arabic language - while appearing on Arabic media outlets - that completely contradict his moderate tone when speaking English, exposing him as a direct supporter of terrorism, both financially and verbally.

EDITORIAL: Islamic extremists in the workplace - Washington Times

A majority of the Muslim chaplains in the U.S. military were validated by the Graduate School of Islamic and Social Sciences, part of Cordoba University in Leesburg, founded by Taha Jabir Al-Awani, president of the Fiqh Council of North America.

A fatwa from this institution on Muslims serving in the U.S. military states, "We abide by every law of this country except those laws that are contradictory to Islamic law."

In other words, Shariah is supreme to the officer's oath to the Constitution. An endorsement from this group should be considered a red flag, not qualification to serve.

 

[DinkinFlicka]

Any one that thinks this is not about a monument to the Muslim triumph over American capitalism, is blind or just not very well read.

You say this as though Al-Qaeda has already won. If we show how easily shaken we are, then maybe they have. It would be un-American to reject this... you can't pick and choose what's unconstitutional and what is. Doesn't work like that. Also, it's not a mosque.

 

[CSpindizzy]

You say this as though Al-Qaeda has already won. If we show how easily shaken we are, then maybe they have. It would be un-American to reject this... you can't pick and choose what's unconstitutional and what is. Doesn't work like that. Also, it's not a mosque.

The organization itself says a mosque will be there. Unless Cordoba itself is wrong about what it is doing.

 

[droski]

You say this as though Al-Qaeda has already won. If we show how easily shaken we are, then maybe they have. It would be un-American to reject this... you can't pick and choose what's unconstitutional and what is. Doesn't work like that. Also, it's not a mosque.

where in the constitution does it say you can build whatever you want wherever you want to? hell you should see what i have to through to get a permit to build apartment buildings.

 

[sjt18]

You say this as though Al-Qaeda has already won. If we show how easily shaken we are, then maybe they have. It would be un-American to reject this... you can't pick and choose what's unconstitutional and what is. Doesn't work like that. Also, it's not a mosque.

The cutting edge of this issue and what we need to be talking about is to what degree we treat Islam as a religion and to what degree we treat it as a political movement. In its orthodox form, it is both. As a political movement, its ideals are not congruent to ours.

 

[lumberjack4]

Is it a bad idea? Yeah more bad than good. But to say it shouldn't be permitted is complete and utter BS gs and you know it.

 

[droski]

Is it a bad idea? Yeah more bad than good. But to say it shouldn't be permitted is complete and utter BS gs and you know it.

as i said before we dont' permit a lot of things to be built. seems like we are actually going out of our way to do things we wouldn't do for other people if we bow tot he pressure and allow it to be built.

 

[lumberjack4]

The phrase, 'it shouldn't be permitted' means that the government should come in and stop it. I think the government going out of its way to stay out of this issue reeks of freedom and is a good thing.

As I've stated before, if the government sees dirty money going into the project they can revoke those funds. I guess if the government can determine that this mosque has an evil intent (which in and of itself I don't believe) they can stop it. But when the government starts playing the intent game things get ugly.

 

[droski]

if there is no evil intent for the mosque why a) do they need to built it at that location and b) why wouldn't they agree to build it somewhere else if they are trying to make american/islam relations better?

 

[lumberjack4]

By evil intent I mean them training terrorist in the building. Building it as a trophy to Islam isn't an evil act. I think we all agree that the improving of relationships is a BS explanation.

 

[KB5252]

I don't think the government should step in and stop it being built. What I'm hoping for is that the people behind the planned center/mosque see the public outcry and decide that building on this site would be counter to their stated goals and opt to build elsewhere. If they decide to go forward they accept the backlash that results.

 

[droski]

if building it as a trophy to islam encourages terrorism (which i'd argue it most definetely will) than the intent is not really relavant IMO.

 

[tvolsfan]

if building it as a trophy to islam encourages terrorism (which i'd argue it most definetely will) than the intent is not really relavant IMO.

Agreed, but it saying that in public=racism/ignorance...

 

[lumberjack4]

Should we stop building skyscrapers since it will only encourage the terrorists to fly a plane into them? Should we convert to Sharia Law because if we don't it will only encourage the terrorists to attack us? Seems like we should trade one bogus religion for another to appease the terrorists.

 

[tvolsfan]

I don't think the government should step in and stop it being built. What I'm hoping for is that the people behind the planned center/mosque see the public outcry and decide that building on this site would be counter to their stated goals and opt to build elsewhere. If they decide to go forward they accept the backlash that results.

Completely agree

 

[CSpindizzy]

They don't even have the funding yet. The guy is clearly using the whole controversy to drum up funds for this whole project. He's pimping out his religion and the emotions of 9/11 to get money and attention. Somehow the "nobility" of tolerance and understanding gets flushed down the toilet when all the facts are laid out on the table.

 

[droski]

Should we stop building skyscrapers since it will only encourage the terrorists to fly a plane into them? Should we convert to Sharia Law because if we don't it will only encourage the terrorists to attack us? Seems like we should trade one bogus religion for another to appease the terrorists.

there are plenty of skyscrapers in the middle east and people haven't been flying planes into them. i don't think building they skyscapers is the problem. building a mosque in the place of the greatest islamic terrorist attack in history isn't really comparable and let's face it isn't some sort of repeatable event that stopping would somehow ruin america for the rest of us.

 

[lumberjack4]

No, but it opens up a can of worms that most in this country won't be willing to deal with when they're on the other side of the stick. It matters not to me if this place is built or not. However, I do not want the government to shut it down, simply because the public doesn't like it.

 

[droski]

you think the sole reason this would get blocked is because the public doesn't like it? there are national security concerns here.

 

[lumberjack4]

Yet, nothing to date has been proved. Until then...

 

[droski]

as far as i'm concerned it's absolute fact that terrorists will see a mosque in this location as some sort of sign that what they did was right. that's enough for me to ban this thing.

 

[gsvol]

You say this as though Al-Qaeda has already won. If we show how easily shaken we are, then maybe they have. It would be un-American to reject this... you can't pick and choose what's unconstitutional and what is. Doesn't work like that. Also, it's not a mosque.

Rauf boasted about his towering structure by Ground Zero as:

“an icon that will make Muslims proud, not only locally but globally.”

The cutting edge of this issue and what we need to be talking about is to what degree we treat Islam as a religion and to what degree we treat it as a political movement. In its orthodox form, it is both. As a political movement, its ideals are not congruent to ours.

Not unless we would enjoy being a conquered nation subject to the whims of soem elite in a far distant capitol.

Is it a bad idea? Yeah more bad than good. But to say it shouldn't be permitted is complete and utter BS gs and you know it.

NOT I DO NOT!!

The phrase, 'it shouldn't be permitted' means that the government should come in and stop it. I think the government going out of its way to stay out of this issue reeks of freedom and is a good thing.

As I've stated before, if the government sees dirty money going into the project they can revoke those funds. I guess if the government can determine that this mosque has an evil intent (which in and of itself I don't believe) they can stop it. But when the government starts playing the intent game things get ugly.

Read this.

How does one go from being a waiter to being a multi-million dollar Manhattan property owner in four short years???

Look things got ugly a long damned time ago and it's high time that people like you realized that!!!

By evil intent I mean them training terrorist in the building. Building it as a trophy to Islam isn't an evil act. I think we all agree that the improving of relationships is a BS explanation.

"Mosques are our barracks!!!"

For fourteen hundred years islam has used mosques are military barracks and amories, catch a clue the first chance you get.

 

[sjt18]

Is it a bad idea? Yeah more bad than good. But to say it shouldn't be permitted is complete and utter BS gs and you know it.

Which are we dealing with?

Is this just a religious establishment?

Or, would this be akin to allowing the Japanese to build a Japanese cultural center at Pearl Harbor in 1942?