Montana discussion (split from Archie thread)

#9
#9
Correct. And the opinion that I have that Montana is the goat is shared by most fans, media, analysts, and former players.

False. Haven't heard an analyst make that statement in some time. If you took a poll of fans he would never be over 50 percent which would be "most". How many former players have made this statement?
 
#10
#10
False. Haven't heard an analyst make that statement in some time. If you took a poll of fans he would never be over 50 percent which would be "most". How many former players have made this statement?

You haven't heard an analyst say that in some time? I guess you didn't watch tv the few days following last years Super Bowl. That's all that was being debated, Montana or Brady? Most of the analyst sided with Montana.
 
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#11
#11
You haven't heard an analyst say that in some time? I guess you didn't watch tv the few days following last years Super Bowl. That's all that was being debated, Montana or Brady? Most of the analyst sided with Montana.

4 - 0 in Super Bowls, 11 TD's, 0 INT's . . .
 
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#12
#12
You haven't heard an analyst say that in some time? I guess you didn't watch tv the few days following last years Super Bowl. That's all that was being debated, Montana or Brady? Most of the analyst sided with Montana.

Montana had the most around him and had the benefit of playing in an innovative system. I will agree about the time in which he played but
Unitas, Marino, etc. Montana was great but I disagree about him being the greatest. Just my opinion which is OK to have.
 
#15
#15
Correct. And the opinion that I have that Montana is the goat is shared by most fans, media, analysts, and former players.

Montana happened to play on the best offense (talent wise best receiver duo ever and also phenomenal RB) and where all plays were called by the best offensive coach ever (Walsh was a genius who supposedly charted the first 20 offensive plays of the games before the games even started). Therefore Montana was totally a system QB who given his relatively modest individual stats (if I remember correctly top 20 or so in total career TD's and yards) should be lucky to even be considered as top 10 all times). By the way, we just went through that whole argument about Brady so please don't tell me you still don't get this simple concept where TEAM accomplishments do not equate to PLAYER accomplishments). By the way, didn't Steve Young pick up where Montana left it without hardly any dropoff in terms of SF winning (another proof that was all about that system and having Jerry Rice to throw the ball too).
 
#16
#16
Montana happened to play on the best offense (talent wise best receiver duo ever and also phenomenal RB) and where all plays were called by the best offensive coach ever (Walsh was a genius who supposedly charted the first 20 offensive plays of the games before the games even started). Therefore Montana was totally a system QB who given his relatively modest individual stats (if I remember correctly top 20 or so in total career TD's and yards) should be lucky to even be considered as top 10 all times). By the way, we just went through that whole argument about Brady so please don't tell me you still don't get this simple concept where TEAM accomplishments do not equate to PLAYER accomplishments). By the way, didn't Steve Young pick up where Montana left it without hardly any dropoff in terms of SF winning (another proof that was all about that system and having Jerry Rice to throw the ball too).

Wow go figure, he had good teammates supporting him. He won two Super Bowls before Jerry Rice and John Taylor ever arrived in SF, so there is that. And yes the 49ers didn't have a big drop off after he left, because he was replaced by a HOF QB. So I guess you think Steve Young was just a system QB as well. Your statement that he's fortunate to be ranked in the top 10 QB's of all time tells me everything I need to know about your football acumen.
 
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#18
#18
#19
#19
Montana happened to play on the best offense (talent wise best receiver duo ever and also phenomenal RB) and where all plays were called by the best offensive coach ever (Walsh was a genius who supposedly charted the first 20 offensive plays of the games before the games even started). Therefore Montana was totally a system QB who given his relatively modest individual stats (if I remember correctly top 20 or so in total career TD's and yards) should be lucky to even be considered as top 10 all times). By the way, we just went through that whole argument about Brady so please don't tell me you still don't get this simple concept where TEAM accomplishments do not equate to PLAYER accomplishments). By the way, didn't Steve Young pick up where Montana left it without hardly any dropoff in terms of SF winning (another proof that was all about that system and having Jerry Rice to throw the ball too).

Actually the 49ers fell off after Montana left. They went from back to back Super Bowl championships to losing the NFC title game he got hurt in, they were leading when he left. To missing the playoffs and being beaten by Dallas until they finally got another title 5 years later. I believe San Francisco would have another title or two had Young not replaced Joe.
 
#21
#21
Peyton played for US. He's in the Superbowl AGAIN. That's all I care about.
 
#22
#22
Actually the 49ers fell off after Montana left. They went from back to back Super Bowl championships to losing the NFC title game he got hurt in, they were leading when he left. To missing the playoffs and being beaten by Dallas until they finally got another title 5 years later. I believe San Francisco would have another title or two had Young not replaced Joe.

In addition to Montana SF lost Craig, Haley, Lott, Paris among others. Losing talent like that from both sides of LOS is going to impact a team regardless.
 
#24
#24
Joe Montana is definitely near the top in the conversation for GOAT, but I think his winning is over-emphasized. He was great, but he was also right place at right time. Bill Walsh and that west coast offense was so innovative and effective, it's still a big part of the NFL.

What happens if Montana goes Dolphins and Marino goes 49ers? I figure JM would have Dan Fouts type numbers and maybe 1 title. He'd be the same QB but it would change the conversation a ton. That's how fickle these things are.
 
#25
#25
Montana happened to play on the best offense (talent wise best receiver duo ever and also phenomenal RB) and where all plays were called by the best offensive coach ever (Walsh was a genius who supposedly charted the first 20 offensive plays of the games before the games even started). Therefore Montana was totally a system QB who given his relatively modest individual stats (if I remember correctly top 20 or so in total career TD's and yards) should be lucky to even be considered as top 10 all times). By the way, we just went through that whole argument about Brady so please don't tell me you still don't get this simple concept where TEAM accomplishments do not equate to PLAYER accomplishments). By the way, didn't Steve Young pick up where Montana left it without hardly any dropoff in terms of SF winning (another proof that was all about that system and having Jerry Rice to throw the ball too).

I love how these arguments are stacked so that it just so happens the great quarterbacks on the greatest teams are punished because they happened to be on great teams. And hardly any dropoff? I don't know about you, but going from 4 Super Bowl wins to 1 is a bit of a dropoff.
 
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