Da Reds thread

[Axion Jaxion]

Originally Posted by VOLinthaATL

Good Lord...please try not to reach at all...

As if Brandon Webb, Jake Peavy, Dan Haren and Chad Billingsley are all over rated because they pitch in the NL West...please...
Posted via VolNation Mobile

I'll take Josh Beckett and Roy Halladay over those few any day of the week.

[JZVOL]

Originally Posted by Axion Jaxion

Really? Gee, where was I when Tim Hudson was pitching with Mark Mulder, Barry Zito, et al in Oakland? I wasn't comparing Huddy and "the little lefty" in that argument.

You were about 8-12.

[Axion Jaxion]

Originally Posted by JZVOL

You were about 8-12.

So? I was extremely advanced and sports savvy. I know all about those A's teams with Hudson, Tejada, Zito, Mulder, Chavez, etc.

[JZVOL]

Originally Posted by Axion Jaxion

So? I was extremely advanced and sports savvy. I know all about those A's teams with Hudson, Tejada, Zito, Mulder, Chavez, etc.

I bet you were.

[vols kick balls]

Baseball stats are pointless. Never mind that baseball is built around statistics and organizations spend millions of dollars to hire the top statisticians around the country. There are 8 total aces in all of baseball. Aaron Harang sucks and has always sucked. I don't care what his stats and performance say, because they are influenced by variables. He sucks.

-Axion Jaxion

[Axion Jaxion]

Originally Posted by vols kick balls

-Axion Jaxion

I never said Aaron Harang sucked. I said he isn't an ace.

[vols kick balls]

Originally Posted by Axion Jaxion

I'm not a fan of stats. If you are going to go by K stats, Mike Mussina had more career K's than Tom Glavine, Warren Spahn, and Sandy Koufax. Are you suggesting "Moose" is better than those 3?

1. Mussina only has more K's than Koufax because he has pitched 6 more seasons than Koufax did.

2. You're an idiot. You can't use only one stat and get the whole picture. If you look at all the stats collectively you can see what caliber pitcher a player was. Glavine and Spahn weren't SO pitchers. They knew how to get batters out in other ways.

3. Stating an opinion as truth without any facts doesn't make you look any smarter.

[Axion Jaxion]

Originally Posted by vols kick balls

1. Mussina only has more K's than Koufax because he has pitched 6 more seasons than Koufax did.

2. You're an idiot. You can't use only one stat and get the whole picture. If you look at all the stats collectively you can see what caliber pitcher a player was. Glavine and Spahn weren't SO pitchers. They knew how to get batters out in other ways.

Thank you, now you see how silly using stats is. My earlier point about stats is validated. The bolded point is one that I agree with to an extent, but you can't just look at stats, you have to thoroughly research the other variables to determine how truly effective a pitcher was. By the way, why do you have to take personal shots?

[vols kick balls]

Originally Posted by Axion Jaxion

Thank you, now you see how silly using stats is. My earlier point about stats is validated. The bolded point is one that I agree with to an extent, but you can't just look at stats, you have to thoroughly research the other variables to determine how truly effective a pitcher was. By the way, why do you have to take personal shots?

What parts of Harang's 06 and 07 stats don't scream "Ace" then?

[Axion Jaxion]

Originally Posted by vols kick balls

What parts of Harang's 06 and 07 stats don't scream "Ace" then?

Usually, an ace's best year isn't one in which his ERA is in the high 3's.

[vols kick balls]

Originally Posted by Axion Jaxion

Usually, an ace's best year isn't one in which his ERA is in the high 3's.

But you are looking at only one stat. Don't cherry pick. He was a FB and SO pitcher that played in a high-capacity soft ball stadium. He had one of the worst defensive teams of this decade behind him both years.

Reds Defense in 06-
LF- Dunn, worst out fielder in baseball
CF- Griffey Jr. Had the range of a first baseman playing center
3B- Edwin Encarnacion, sucks defensively
SS- Felipe Lopez, has since moved to 2B and he sucks there too
C- Javy Valentin, sucks
Utility- Ryan Freel, best player in baseball at screwing routine plays up

Reds Defense in '07-
LF- Dunn, see above
CF/RF- Jr, see above
3B- Edwin- see above
SS- Jeff Keppinger, 0 range what so ever and no arm strength to speak of
3B/1B/OF- Jorge Cantu, only use for him was his stick cause he can't field a GB to save his life
OF- Norris Hopper, took the worst routs to FBs in all of baseball
Utility- Freel, see above

Take your own advice. Look at all the stats.

[tidwell]

Originally Posted by Axion Jaxion

Cliff Lee is the American League's Tim Hudson. Both are above average Number 2 or 3 types, but not aces.

Wow.

I'd love to have a starting rotation in which Tim Hudson or Cliff Lee was the third starter.

[Axion Jaxion]

Originally Posted by tidwell

Wow.

I'd love to have a starting rotation in which Tim Hudson or Cliff Lee was the third starter.

You should stick to your NASCRAP forum and your mindless "is he a former poster" games.

[tidwell]

Originally Posted by Axion Jaxion

You should stick to your NASCRAP forum and your mindless "is he a former poster" games.

Why, are you going to threaten me with your thesaurus?

By the way, that laughing you were talking about earlier, pretty sure that your "friends" aren't laughing with you, but rather...

[Axion Jaxion]

Bottom Line: Aaron Harang is not nor has he ever been an "ace". Think what you want, I don't care.