Derek Jeter

#1
Sin City Vol

Sin City Vol

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#1
I know most people hate the Yankees and as he's ending hiscareer many are starting to say Jeter is a little overrated. I just read this article from Jason Stark and it's really amazing what he has accomplished compared to some of the rgeats that ever played. I know I know bash the Yankees it's all good but this is some pretty cool info.

Ten astounding Derek Jeter numbers - Jayson Stark Blog - ESPN
 
#4
#4
I'll just leave this here...

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__UJ9VZB508[/youtube]
 
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#5
#5
Oh he's not the greatest player ever but during a time of roids, domestic abuse etc in sports...Jeter may be the greatest amabassador to the game that we have ever seen
 
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#8
#8
The truth lies somewhere in the middle of Stark's love fest and Olbermann's bashing. Jeter is probably the most consistent offensive player across the boatd of my lifetime. Yea names like Ichiro and Gwynn pop out, but I take Jeter's bat over both. Tons of players had more pop and wow factor offensively, but I argue no one was more consistent.

Defensively however, Jeter was at best average and I would personally argue somewhat below average. Very few SSs over the past twenty years had less range than Jeter. His arm isn't even great.
 
#9
#9
volfanbill said:
The truth lies somewhere in the middle of Stark's love fest and Olbermann's bashing. Jeter is probably the most consistent offensive player across the boatd of my lifetime. Yea names like Ichiro and Gwynn pop out, but I take Jeter's bat over both. Tons of players had more pop and wow factor offensively, but I argue no one was more consistent.

Defensively however, Jeter was at best average and I would personally argue somewhat below average. Very few SSs over the past twenty years had less range than Jeter. His arm isn't even great.
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There are about 10 players over Jeter's prime I would take over him EASY.
 
#10
#10
Also how can Jeter be a more consistent offensive player than Gywnn when he had a better average, on base, slugging, and played in a harder park to hit?
 
#11
#11
Derek Jeter and Kobe Bryant SHOULD go down as the two most overrated "superstars" of my generation. Both guys are HOFers but have gotten way too much adulation as players.
 
#12
#12
PKT_VOL said:
Normally not a fan of Olbermann, but he summed up my thoughts pretty well.
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Colin Cowherd pretty much destroyed Olbermann's rant on his show yesterday morning. Keith is a blabbering idiot
 
#14
#14
zjcvols said:
Might be but he's completely right here
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He's a SS. He played during the steroid era and played on a Yankees team full of steroid players and led the team in batting 17/20 years. Tony Gwynn, and several other SS's, including Ozzie Smith never won MVPs.

I encourage you to listen to Colin's show yesterday and you'll realize that Keith's rant is idiotic.
 
#15
#15
zjcvols said:
Also how can Jeter be a more consistent offensive player than Gywnn when he had a better average, on base, slugging, and played in a harder park to hit?
Click to expand...

I couldn't care less about my #2 hitter having an overly high slugging percentage. It's also a lot easier to hit good numbers when you're on a team that's already out of the playoff picture in mid May.
 
#16
#16
I am guilty of being the ultimate fan boy when it comes to Jeter. I've been a lifelong Stros fan, but it was really hard not to jump on the Yankee's bandwagon about the time Jeter began his career. My father was a Yankee fan since Mickey was "his guy" so it was acceptable in our house to pull for them. Jeter became my guy around 98, and when the 99 season began, I think I had more Jeter gear than any Astro.

Throughout college, I recall playing MLB on playstation against my buddy who was a tremendous Brave's honk. Night after night it was Bud Ice, cold pizza, Yanks v Braves. Always.

My dad had a lot of connections within the Stros organization. He'd conducted a ton of business with several players and even a handful of coaches. Dad was a personal friend of Nolan's father so it wasn't uncommon for us to catch a post game meal with guys on the team. Guys like Terry Puhl, Jim Deshaies, Alan Ashby all knew Dad pretty well.

Dad landed us seats during the opening series of Enron in Houston vs the Yankees so my buddy and I made the drive to Houston to meet up with my parents. We had seats right behind the Yankees dugout so we we're pretty excited obviously. There we were, two kids from Texas in Jeter jerseys snapping photos and begging for a wave from guys like Roger Clemens, Paul Oneil, Bernie Williams, Jorge Posada, Joe Torre, and of course Jeter. The thing that solidified my fandom of him happened when we're leaning over the railing to grab an autograph from Torre and Jeter pops up from underneath. He says "nice shirt fellas, thanks for coming to the ball park" hands us some batting gloves he'd already signed for us. I looked at dad in a confused manner and asked him how he pulled that off for us. He just said "I guess he must have saw y'all."

Dad is/was my hero and he died never telling me how he pulled that off, but to a 20 year old kid that day, Jeter became an icon to me.

Baseball does that more so than any other sport. It's something shared between a father and son. I've never seen a game at Yankee stadium but when I do, I'm taking my girls down to Monument park to see #2's plaque. I don't know how I'll pull it off, but I'm going to.

Call me a fan boy all you want, but I'm just know, in regards to Jeter, I'm completely cool with that label.
 
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#17
#17
That's a cool story man. That's awesome to be able to have that memory.
 
#18
#18
volfanbill said:
The truth lies somewhere in the middle of Stark's love fest and Olbermann's bashing. Jeter is probably the most consistent offensive player across the boatd of my lifetime. Yea names like Ichiro and Gwynn pop out, but I take Jeter's bat over both. Tons of players had more pop and wow factor offensively, but I argue no one was more consistent.

Defensively however, Jeter was at best average and I would personally argue somewhat below average. Very few SSs over the past twenty years had less range than Jeter. His arm isn't even great.
Click to expand...

There is no way that Jeter was better offensively than Tony Gwynn.
 
#19
#19
GAVol said:
There is no way that Jeter was better offensively than Tony Gwynn.
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I guess I should have said names like Ichiro and Gwynn pop out and other players had more pop and wow factor.

Oh wait. I did say that. It was infinitely easier for Gwynn to hit the majority of his career because teams didn't have to fear for him driving in the guy in front of him because no one in front of him got on.
 
#20
#20
Am I getting trolled or something?

Wouldn't it have actually been harder on Gwynn since teams could just pitch around him? Just about everybody's average goes up with runners on base.
 
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#21
#21
GAVol said:
Am I getting trolled or something?

Wouldn't it have actually been harder on Gwynn since teams could just pitch around him? Just about everybody's average goes up with runners on base.
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Yeah not buying his argument.
 
#22
#22
GAVol said:
Am I getting trolled or something?

Wouldn't it have actually been harder on Gwynn since teams could just pitch around him? Just about everybody's average goes up with runners on base.
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Glad I wasn't the only one
 
#23
#23
GAVol said:
Am I getting trolled or something?

Wouldn't it have actually been harder on Gwynn since teams could just pitch around him? Just about everybody's average goes up with runners on base.
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Depends on how they pitched around him. Few could work a count like Gwynn, and he laid off a lot of purposeful bad pitches to draw walks. When they gave him something to hit, he hit it. They pitched to Jeter because he always had a formidable middle if the lineup and he hit the ball and drew walks.

Gwynn never faced half the pressure Jeter did. Half of Gwynn's career was on sub .500 teams. Only a couple of seasons achieved 90 wins. Jeter never played a season where they weren't in the playoff picture during the last week of the season.
 
#24
#24
volfanbill said:
Depends on how they pitched around him. Few could work a count like Gwynn, and he laid off a lot of purposeful bad pitches to draw walks. When they gave him something to hit, he hit it. They pitched to Jeter because he always had a formidable middle if the lineup and he hit the ball and drew walks.

Gwynn never faced half the pressure Jeter did. Half of Gwynn's career was on sub .500 teams. Only a couple of seasons achieved 90 wins. Jeter never played a season where they weren't in the playoff picture during the last week of the season.
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I still think that's a completely flawed argument. But more than that the thing is, we're not even debating a couple of guys whose numbers are roughly the same. Gwynn hit 29 points higher and had an OPS 30 points higher. That's not even the same offensive stratosphere.
 
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