Is it time to rethink John Calipari?

#1

Chas in Boca

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#1
So, I'm a Gator and obviously this is a Vol message board. I would think neither of our fan bases traditionally have had a lot of love for Kentucky basketball or John Calipari.

That said, I was watching this 30 for 30 film that's been airing on ESPN about him, "One and Not Done," and I found my opinion of him changing. I was curious to see if anyone else felt the same?

Basically, I think Calipari has gotten a bad rap. The common refrain about this guy is that he's a sleazy, slick-talking, cheater who lands every program he's associated with into hot water with the NCAA. Yet, in reality, this is just a guy descended from Italian immigrants who grew up on the wrong side of the tracks and has been resented by the establishment for daring to grind his way to the top and breathe their rarefied air. He didn't go to Duke, Carolina, Kansas, UCLA, etc...his mom and grandmother were lunch ladies at a school cafeteria and several of the males in his family worked the coal mines in Pennsylvania. His break in the game of basketball came through his hard work at those old "Five Star" basketball camps.

After a couple unglamorous positions as Larry Brown's errand-boy at Kansas (granted, just being on Brown's staff certainly added some credibility...) and then an assistant at Pittsburgh, he got his first head coaching break at one of the worst programs in the country at the time, UMASS. I think they said UMASS had won like 2 games the year before he arrived and neither were against D1 competition. What does he do? Immediately begins knocking heads with the big boys in the A10 and out-recruiting them. Now, some will say this is where his cheating comes into play - but how clean were those other programs? I think he just hustled more. You had John Cheney sitting there at Temple at the time and he just expected all the other coaches at those other A10 programs to simply step aside for him; basically giving him carte blanche. TV appearances, recruiting, etc...he didn't like it when Calipari dared to come in and challenge him. Is that John's fault for not kissing Cheney's behind? Again, we see the Italian kid just trying to grind and make it. Before people knew it, he was beating Cheney's Temple teams and took UMASS to a Final Four. Cheney resented his success so much that he actually tried to fight him at a postgame press conference one time. Obviously, you had the Marcus Camby situation...but, again, was that even on Calipari? The money filtered to Camby and his friends was in Connecticut - it never had anything to do with Massachusetts, per se.

Anyway, then Cal goes to the NBA. Takes the moribund Nets franchise to the playoffs in like his second year. How? Again, by grinding and out-hustling other teams. They lose to Jordan's Bulls dynasty, then the lockout happens, and the Nets, tired of his grinding ways and desiring a more passive voice, eventually decided to make a change the following season after a slow start. Cal didn't deserve that, in my opinion.

Then, the Memphis situation. Some of you who are TN residents may have more knowledge and a different perspective on his time there than me, but I see this as one more chapter of the establishment attempting to lock this guy out of the limelight. He deserved a more prestigious college job after the Nets situation, but the blue bloods wouldn't touch him because of his methodology at UMASS. So, he goes to Memphis and basically just says, "F you," to the establishment. That's how I interpret that whole Memphis scenario....Worldwide Wes, Dajuan Wagner, Derrick Rose. Was Memphis squeaky clean? Probably not, but I don't think they were as dirty as people made them out to be, either. I think Cal was basically just saying, "If you aren't going to open the front door for me, I'll find another way to get in...the back door, side door, windows...doesn't matter, but I'll find a way." That's really all Memphis was and it's hard to fault the guy for that.

Finally, Kentucky brings him on board and he finally has the chance to operate a basketball program with establishment-style resources. Kentucky actually deserves credit for going against the grain and opening a door for this guy, in my opinion. I know it's easy to hate them for their success, but if you step back and look at it, Kentucky has been a victim here, too. The NCAA and the establishment has resented them for hiring Cal and endorsing his "one and done" approach. I may get laughed off the board for this next sentence, but it's true: Kentucky doesn't get any calls. The refs ride them nonstop. The documentary highlights a shafting they received down at Texas A&M a couple years ago - to the point that Calipari just point blank told his team in the locker room afterwards, "You got cheated." Then you think about their tournament game against Wisconsin a couple years ago, the game against UCONN, this year against UNC....even in the SEC, where they clearly are head and shoulders above the rest of our programs, it's hard for them to get calls even in Rupp. And when you go back and look at how UMASS and Memphis used to get shafted in the tournament, you can see it's because of Cal. All of the talent he's assembled over the years, and the guy only has one national title? He should have at least 3 or 4...maybe more...but the establishment refuses to let him succeed the way they do Krzyzewski, Williams, etc. I'll even say Donovan got fairer treatment despite being at a football school than Cal because he didn't rock the establishment.

So, with all of that said, I now find myself rooting for Calipari except when he plays UF. Kentucky and Cal were always billed as these villains because of the history in that program and the way Cal hoards top recruits with his "one and done approach," but it's pretty obvious after that documentary that they are actually the underdogs fighting the uphill battle. Every game, they're not just facing a standard opponent, but also the refs and an establishment that doesn't want them to succeed. All because they have a coach who dared to grind his way out of poverty in Pittsburgh and out-hustle the bigger name coaches. Cal's not a sleaze bag - I think he really is more of a "dream facilitator" (when you consider it's every prospect's goal to get to the NBA as soon as possible) and all you have to do is look at how many former players had his back at the Hall of Fame induction to see the impact he's made.

I really believe the SEC should do more to celebrate Calipari and his approach to college basketball. The SEC really isn't part of that basketball establishment anyway, so it could be a natural alliance. Kentucky may have to fight the national refs in the NCAA Tournament every year - they probably just expect that by now - but they shouldn't have to get jobbed night-in and night-out in their own conference all year. Cal should be getting the same calls at Rupp that K gets at Cameron and Roy at the Dean Dome. This would allow the committee less leeway when it comes to screwing UK in their seeding, which has also been documented. I don't see how this would affect UF or Tennessee, etc, much because we're football schools anyway and don't expect to consistently compete with UK in basketball as it is.

Again, not a Kentucky fan and I know some will disagree with this assessment, but I think it's time for all of us to rethink the hatred for Cal and UK. Let's give the Italian boy from the poor part of town a fair chance and honor him for his achievements. It's not right what they've done to this guy and his reputation.
 
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#2
#2
I watched it last night. I admit I dont hate him as much as I did before, but I still think it cant be a coincidence every school he has been to has had to vacate wins. He is good at playing dumb but I dont buy that he was completely oblivious to what was going on with Camby and Rose. And the fact he has such a tight relationship with Worldwide Wes. Now that guy is as dirty as they come imo.
 
#3
#3
I haven't watched much of the 30 for 30, but be careful with everything that you got from it. I think it was created to further promote him and supposed to put him in a positive light.

That said, I respect Cal for what he has done, but I don't feel sorry for him for not having more titles. I am from Memphis, and he had his first title wrapped up in 2008, and he and his players "choked." Players missed late free throws, and Cal refused to foul up three, which allowed Chalmers to tie it. They never had a chance in OT because they couldn't believe they had given up the lead. Cal is not the best in-game coach. He isn't terrible, but he has made mistakes in big games.

Cal has definitely taken advantage of the one and done, but it's not ironic that he has won the one year he had some veteran leadership, even if one was just a sophomore. Even highly talented freshmen get nervous when it's "one (loss) and done."

I know Cal pretty well being from Memphis, nd he is a master motivator, great recruiter, and great marketer for his program. He knows how to play the game with the best of them. He is also a master manipulator. He would say things publicly about stats or a player that the fans would cling to. Then when you check the stats, it simply wasn't true. Just the way he is, and he almost always gets his way.

I have no doubt that his ways caught up with him at UMass and UM. Whether he knew it or not, no one can really say. But again, he was playing the game, which the best ones do. Darrelle Arthur had some grade fixing in high school on that championship Kansas team, but they won and the NCAA didn't care. Cal isn't the only one who does it, but it still happened.

All that said, Cal is good for the college game. He has helped many kids make millions of dollars. He is very practical when he discusses the future with them. Good for him. As a UT fan though, I respect him, but it is very hard for me to pull for him. You will also not hear me say that UK gets shafted by the officials. I have watched too many games at Rupp to even consider that. Has he gotten bad calls? Sure. Does he only have one title simply because of poor officiating? Absolutely not.
 
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#5
#5
Nope. I still think the guy is a sleaze.

Pretty much the generic boring response I was expecting from every fan who can't be bothered with rational thinking.

To me, Calipari is a WYSWYG person. He's a car salesman. He knows, and is very talented, what he is doing. He's in your face with what he wants to do, and doesn't mind rubbing others the wrong way. But he's a genuinely nice man if you ever get to spend time with him, he genuinely cares about the players, and he's happy at UK. That's good enough for me. As long as he's winning 30+ and taking us to the Elite 8 or further, he'll be here. We're bound to win another eventually.
 
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#6
#6
Pretty much the generic boring response I was expecting from every fan who can't be bothered with rational thinking.

To me, Calipari is a WYSWYG person. He's a car salesman. He knows, and is very talented, what he is doing. He's in your face with what he wants to do, and doesn't mind rubbing others the wrong way. But he's a genuinely nice man if you ever get to spend time with him, he genuinely cares about the players, and he's happy at UK. That's good enough for me. As long as he's winning 30+ and taking us to the Elite 8 or further, he'll be here. We're bound to win another eventually.



You're also bound to get in some kind of trouble with him. History bears it out.

What he does works for him and he seems to care about his players.

Can't knock him for being successful. I also can't knock him for bending the rules as it is my opinion that the entire system is bent. He's doing what it takes to survive and is thriving.

...as always, the truth is somewhere in the middle.
 
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#7
#7
You're also bound to get in some kind of trouble with him. History bears it out.

What he does works for him and he seems to care about his players.

Can't knock him for being successful. I also can't knock him for bending the rules as it is my opinion that the entire system is bent. He's doing what it takes to survive and is thriving.

...as always, the truth is somewhere in the middle.

I think one thing to consider is that he had to bend the rules to get where he is. UMass wasn't nearly a big enough platform to sustain big-time success for a young, inexperienced coach without bending the rules. Even Memphis wasn't big enough, mostly due to a small profile conference affiliation. But, you give him a platform like UK, and his recruiting prowess, then things come together so that he no longer has to bend the rules, at least not like he did at his other stops. His situation now simply sells itself.
 
#9
#9
My thoughts - No way UMASS got that good without cheating. He was the guy in charge so I associate that with him. Memphis also had to vacate their final four with him in charge.
 
#10
#10
I enjoyed the 30 for 30. I vividly remember his UMass teams.

That being said, I still don't like the guy one bit.
 
#12
#12
If UK sells itself in basketball, how come Tubby or Gillespie couldn't recruit at a high level like Cal does? He might be successful but no way in hell does Cal play by the rules. If you think he gets four-five 5*s each class without any kind of cheating then you're crazy.
 
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#13
#13
I've always been ok with him recruiting "one and done players" the thing I have a problem with is his lack of respect for other teams or coaches. If you notice if his team loses its ALWAYS because they weren't play well instead of the other team playing well or forcing mistakes or controlling the pace of the game.
 
#14
#14
I also feel like that 30 for 30 episode was extremely bias in Cal's favor. Now that hes at Kensucky ESPN is all over his jock, they probably had to agree to some conditions to get him to be involved. He wouldn't have been ok with them bashing him.
 
#15
#15
If UK sells itself in basketball, how come Tubby or Gillespie couldn't recruit at a high level like Cal does? He might be successful but no way in hell does Cal play by the rules. If you think he gets four-five 5*s each class without any kind of cheating then you're crazy.

Nobody had recruited like Cal ever before, so it's not fair to make that comparison to Tubby or Gillispie. Neither guy coached in the one-and-done era either. Tubby was never an elite recruiter, and Gillispie was more interested in extra-curricular activities off the court.

However, UK has always been an elite program, even through their dark times. Add Cal and his recruiting prowess to an elite blueblood program, and you have what UK is now. That combination would exist if Cal had gone to UNC, Duke, UCLA, or Kansas too. The key is the combination of the three things together; elite program and a great recruiter in the one-and-done era.
 
#16
#16
My thoughts - No way UMASS got that good without cheating. He was the guy in charge so I associate that with him. Memphis also had to vacate their final four with him in charge.

How Donta Bright (1992) out of Dunbar HS in Baltimore became academically eligible is still a mystery. He was a 6'6 McDonald's All American from the best High School team in the country but wasn't being recruited by most of the elite programs at the time because it was assumed he would have to go to Junior College (straight to the NBA from HS didn't become common until Garnett in '95). Ohio St even backed away from him. Somehow, Calipari has always been able to get those at risk players enrolled and eligible.
 
#17
#17
Nothing to rethink. It was a fluff piece. Ask Umass and Memphis what they think of him. Both were left in a mess when he departed. Calipari is anything but upstanding. I'll give him hard working and that's all.
 
#18
#18
He is very wealthy and probably thinks average Kentucky fan is a complete idiot ...?you know he likes taking calls from the fans in Southeast Ky
 
#19
#19
I wouldn't call it "rethinking," but yes, he absolutely gets a bad rap. Pearl is way more sleazy IMO and this site mostly likes him
 
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#20
#20
30 for 30 could direct a special about Lane Kiffin and make him look great.
 
#21
#21
I still feel that the 08 Memphis team is better than most of his current Kentucky teams. That team of course had the freshman sensation Rose but it had a good makeup of veteran players too that played his system well.
 
#23
#23
30 for 30 could direct a special about Lane Kiffin and make him look great.

This

I haven't watched the 30 for 30 on him, but if it's like the other fluff, rebuild Cal things of late, it's literally branding his sleaziness as a good thing. I can't support that
 
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#24
#24
This

I haven't watched the 30 for 30 on him, but if it's like the other fluff, rebuild Cal things of late, it's literally branding his sleaziness as a good thing. I can't support that

Cal is upfront about sleaziness at least. Not trying to hide it in dorms (UL) or fake classrooms (UNC). Cal promotes and does what he can to build his rep. Every coach wishes they were as good as him at it.
 
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#25
#25
Cal is upfront about sleaziness at least. Not trying to hide it in dorms (UL) or fake classrooms (UNC). Cal promotes and does what he can to build his rep. Every coach wishes they were as good as him at it.

And if he WAS the coach at Carolina right now. Or some other school you wouldnt be supportive of him. I dont buy for one second any UK fan that would be if he wasnt their coach.
 

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