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Old 05-14-2010, 07:45 PM   #31
 milohimself 
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O rly?

If FSU's last four years is "owning the ACC" then Tennessee has been owning the SEC in the same time frame.
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Old 05-15-2010, 10:09 AM   #32
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F$U has spoken internally about joining the SEC, should they be invited.
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Old 05-15-2010, 04:46 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VOLnMiami View Post
Florida State has been offered TWICE and refused TWICE....With good reason, Why leave a great situation?...They own the ACC in football...11 ACC football titles....Miami is a better fit and the people in gainesville would have a stroke over having to play them every year.
who gives a crap about people in gainesville? the refused twice with dumbass bowden. i think they seriously look at it now with jimbo
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Old 05-15-2010, 05:01 PM   #34
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The money disparity between the ACC and the SEC has grown quite a bit since FSU joined the ACC in the early 90's. The ACC leadership is continuing its focus on basketball to the neglect of football, so the disparity is only going to get worse (example: losing one of their premier bowl tie ins (Gator) to the SEC, and replacing it with the Sun Bowl in El Paso Texas). FSU is also watching the talent and money gap between them and Florida continue to grow. At one point the two programs were considered equals, and had a good rivalry. Now FSU is a just a guaranteed W for the Gators, largely due to the Gator's SEC tie in (money/recruiting). I can't imagine the Seminole fans are okay with that status. Further, if the SEC does expand, there's a good chance it would include an ACC team like Miami, UVa, Clemson, Ga Tech, etc. I doubt FSU wants to be left behind in an even weaker ACC.

I'm liking the idea of adding WVU in the east, and FSU in the west...
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Old 05-19-2010, 06:33 PM   #35
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I think it's looking more and more like something is gonna happen. So here's my stab at a guess. First, I don't think there would be 2 divisions, I think there would be four. Second, I don't think we'd add teams from states where we already have a solid presence. Is GT or Clemson gonna get TV folks excited? It might look something like this...

DIV 1 -Texas,Texas A&M(or Oklahoma),Arkansas, LSU

DIV 2 -Alabama,Auburn,Ole Miss, Miss. St

Div 3 -Virginia Tech,Cincinatti,UK,Vandy

Div 4 -Florida,Tennesee,UGA,USCjr

Cincinatti is a pretty big market, VT is a market where the SEC has no presence, and obviously can you get Texas and Oklahoma/A&M to come over is the billion $ question.

Obviously, you could move some teams around, for instance, Tennessee might well fit in DIV 3 with VT in 4. I'm just saying it might look like this. Of course, keeping Alabama on our schedule and other rivalries at other schools would be important to maintain. I think that could be worked out.


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Old 05-19-2010, 10:16 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Velo Vol View Post
Back to the OP, I assume it would be at least a year off, maybe more. I don't see how they could redo the schedule commitments in a shorter time frame.

Who remembers how it worked in 1992? I don't.
Both Arkansas and South Carolina actually were invited to join in late summer of 1990. They each played the 1990 and 1991 seasons as members of the SWC and independents, respectively. However, the league actually went to 12 teams in basketball during the 1991-92 season.

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Old 05-19-2010, 10:30 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vol66 View Post
I think it's looking more and more like something is gonna happen. So here's my stab at a guess. First, I don't think there would be 2 divisions, I think there would be four. Second, I don't think we'd add teams from states where we already have a solid presence. Is GT or Clemson gonna get TV folks excited? It might look something like this...

DIV 1 -Texas,Texas A&M(or Oklahoma),Arkansas, LSU

DIV 2 -Alabama,Auburn,Ole Miss, Miss. St

Div 3 -Virginia Tech,Cincinatti,UK,Vandy

Div 4 -Florida,Tennesee,UGA,USCjr

Cincinatti is a pretty big market, VT is a market where the SEC has no presence, and obviously can you get Texas and Oklahoma/A&M to come over is the billion $ question.

Obviously, you could move some teams around, for instance, Tennessee might well fit in DIV 3 with VT in 4. I'm just saying it might look like this. Of course, keeping Alabama on our schedule and other rivalries at other schools would be important to maintain. I think that could be worked out.


Bash Away
If we move to 16 teams I do like the 4 division approach somewhat, but there are problems with it. One major problem then would be the SEC championship. Would you have to win TWO more games in order the win the SEC when you're conference schedule is already brutal as hell?

If we moved from the BCS format to a playoff format with the bowls, the 4 division and 2-game championship would work; but with the BCS poll system, it would be impractical.

Another problem would be scheduling and sustaining permanent rivalry games.

Let's say you have to play your own division + one other. Then you would play the three other teams from your division and 4 teams from another, that's seven games, leaving room for OOC games and a permanent foe. In a two division format you would play the other seven teams from your division, still leaving 4 games for permanent rivals, OOC opponents and other division games.

Let's say you had this hypothetical:
1) Texas, Oklahoma, LSU, Arkansas

2) Tennessee, Vandy, Kentucky, Cincinnati

3) Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, FSU

4) Alabama, Miss St., Ole Miss, Auburn

You would have 3 division opponents plus a whole other division plus any permanent rival.

So, in this hypothetical, Tennessee would play Vandy, Kentucky, Cincinnati, and let's say division 3--Florida, Georgia, USCe, and FSU. That would leave 5 other games for OOC and other divisions. Let's say we had permanent games with 'Bama, Florida, and Georgia every season. When we had a season where we play neither one of their divisions we would have only 2 games available OOC and other divisional foes. Of course, that problem would change depending on the divisional line-ups.
______________________________________________
Now, let's consider a two-division set-up:
1)
Tennessee
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
Vandy
USCe
'Bama
Auburn

2)
LSU
Arkansas
Ole Miss
Miss St.
Texas
Oklahoma
Texas A&M
Team X (some other Western team)

Now, this way we would play our 7 divisional foes (with most main rivalries staying intact) leaving 2 games for Western division opponents and 3 games for OCC.

A theoretical schedule:

1) Cream-puff OOC game (OOC)
2) Tough OOC game (OOC)
3) Florida (East Division)
4) Cream-puff OOC game2 (OOC)
5) Oklahoma (West Division)
6) Georgia (East Division)
7) 'Bama (East Division)
8) USCe (East Division)
9) Texas (West Division)
10) Vandy (East Division)
11) Auburn (East Division)
12) Kentucky (East Division)

Such an alignment would keep most of the major rivalries a yearly thing. It gets dicey if the divisions are kept as they currently are and new teams are just added in. It becomes much more difficult to have permanent rivalry games or to have any OOC games at all if that occurs.

In a four division alignment you'd have an even bigger problem of keeping the major rivalries a yearly occurrence.

Sorry for the long post, lol.
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Old 05-20-2010, 06:37 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orangesox View Post
Both Arkansas and South Carolina actually were invited to join in late summer of 1990. They each played the 1990 and 1991 seasons as members of the SWC and independents, respectively. However, the league actually went to 16 teams in basketball during the 1991-92 season.
And just who were the 4 mystery teams in that 91-92 season?
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Old 05-20-2010, 08:48 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TNvol86 View Post
I'm liking the idea of adding WVU in the east, and FSU in the west...
FSU in the west? You may want to take a look at a map.
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Old 05-20-2010, 01:31 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKyleVol View Post
If we move to 16 teams I do like the 4 division approach somewhat, but there are problems with it. One major problem then would be the SEC championship. Would you have to win TWO more games in order the win the SEC when you're conference schedule is already brutal as hell?

If we moved from the BCS format to a playoff format with the bowls, the 4 division and 2-game championship would work; but with the BCS poll system, it would be impractical.

Another problem would be scheduling and sustaining permanent rivalry games.

Let's say you have to play your own division + one other. Then you would play the three other teams from your division and 4 teams from another, that's seven games, leaving room for OOC games and a permanent foe. In a two division format you would play the other seven teams from your division, still leaving 4 games for permanent rivals, OOC opponents and other division games.

Let's say you had this hypothetical:
1) Texas, Oklahoma, LSU, Arkansas

2) Tennessee, Vandy, Kentucky, Cincinnati

3) Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, FSU

4) Alabama, Miss St., Ole Miss, Auburn

You would have 3 division opponents plus a whole other division plus any permanent rival.

So, in this hypothetical, Tennessee would play Vandy, Kentucky, Cincinnati, and let's say division 3--Florida, Georgia, USCe, and FSU. That would leave 5 other games for OOC and other divisions. Let's say we had permanent games with 'Bama, Florida, and Georgia every season. When we had a season where we play neither one of their divisions we would have only 2 games available OOC and other divisional foes. Of course, that problem would change depending on the divisional line-ups.
______________________________________________
Now, let's consider a two-division set-up:
1)
Tennessee
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
Vandy
USCe
'Bama
Auburn

2)
LSU
Arkansas
Ole Miss
Miss St.
Texas
Oklahoma
Texas A&M
Team X (some other Western team)

Now, this way we would play our 7 divisional foes (with most main rivalries staying intact) leaving 2 games for Western division opponents and 3 games for OCC.

A theoretical schedule:

1) Cream-puff OOC game (OOC)
2) Tough OOC game (OOC)
3) Florida (East Division)
4) Cream-puff OOC game2 (OOC)
5) Oklahoma (West Division)
6) Georgia (East Division)
7) 'Bama (East Division)
8) USCe (East Division)
9) Texas (West Division)
10) Vandy (East Division)
11) Auburn (East Division)
12) Kentucky (East Division)

Such an alignment would keep most of the major rivalries a yearly thing. It gets dicey if the divisions are kept as they currently are and new teams are just added in. It becomes much more difficult to have permanent rivalry games or to have any OOC games at all if that occurs.

In a four division alignment you'd have an even bigger problem of keeping the major rivalries a yearly occurrence.

Sorry for the long post, lol.
I appreciate all the thought you put in on your post and I only have one difference of opinion, really. I don't think the university presidents are going to be AS concerned with keeping rivalries as they will be with growing the SEC footprint, population base, TV money, association with schools with academic prestige.

As a fan I think Miami,FSU,GT,VT(or some other schools) makes a lot of sense, the drives aren't bad, there are some natural rivalries etc...The SEC might feel like we already have Florida, how much do we really need another Florida team? Same with Georgia.

As for the way I lined up the divisions, I was just looking at the NFL, which is probably too simplistic, and you made very valid points I'll have to do some more thinkin'.
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Old 05-20-2010, 04:22 PM   #41
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I think FSU and Miami will submarine the ACC out of Florida and Florida recruits for the most part. Also be one heck of a TV market with the whole state in the conference.
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Old 05-20-2010, 10:02 PM   #42
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And just who were the 4 mystery teams in that 91-92 season?
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Proofreading. I admire the concept.
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Old 05-21-2010, 11:44 AM   #43
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Report: SEC Already Eyeing Six Teams For Possible Expansion MrSEC.com

Apparently our good ol' Jimmy broke this story.
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Old 05-21-2010, 04:06 PM   #44
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[url=http://www.mrsec.com/story/report-sec-already-eyeing-six-teams-for-possible-expansion]
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is not so much revelation
Above article in a nutshell.
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Old 05-21-2010, 05:18 PM   #45
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That is one BRUTAL schedule.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKyleVol View Post
If we move to 16 teams I do like the 4 division approach somewhat, but there are problems with it. One major problem then would be the SEC championship. Would you have to win TWO more games in order the win the SEC when you're conference schedule is already brutal as hell?

If we moved from the BCS format to a playoff format with the bowls, the 4 division and 2-game championship would work; but with the BCS poll system, it would be impractical.

Another problem would be scheduling and sustaining permanent rivalry games.

Let's say you have to play your own division + one other. Then you would play the three other teams from your division and 4 teams from another, that's seven games, leaving room for OOC games and a permanent foe. In a two division format you would play the other seven teams from your division, still leaving 4 games for permanent rivals, OOC opponents and other division games.

Let's say you had this hypothetical:
1) Texas, Oklahoma, LSU, Arkansas

2) Tennessee, Vandy, Kentucky, Cincinnati

3) Florida, Georgia, South Carolina, FSU

4) Alabama, Miss St., Ole Miss, Auburn

You would have 3 division opponents plus a whole other division plus any permanent rival.

So, in this hypothetical, Tennessee would play Vandy, Kentucky, Cincinnati, and let's say division 3--Florida, Georgia, USCe, and FSU. That would leave 5 other games for OOC and other divisions. Let's say we had permanent games with 'Bama, Florida, and Georgia every season. When we had a season where we play neither one of their divisions we would have only 2 games available OOC and other divisional foes. Of course, that problem would change depending on the divisional line-ups.
______________________________________________
Now, let's consider a two-division set-up:
1)
Tennessee
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
Vandy
USCe
'Bama
Auburn

2)
LSU
Arkansas
Ole Miss
Miss St.
Texas
Oklahoma
Texas A&M
Team X (some other Western team)

Now, this way we would play our 7 divisional foes (with most main rivalries staying intact) leaving 2 games for Western division opponents and 3 games for OCC.

A theoretical schedule:

1) Cream-puff OOC game (OOC)
2) Tough OOC game (OOC)
3) Florida (East Division)
4) Cream-puff OOC game2 (OOC)
5) Oklahoma (West Division)
6) Georgia (East Division)
7) 'Bama (East Division)
8) USCe (East Division)
9) Texas (West Division)
10) Vandy (East Division)
11) Auburn (East Division)
12) Kentucky (East Division)

Such an alignment would keep most of the major rivalries a yearly thing. It gets dicey if the divisions are kept as they currently are and new teams are just added in. It becomes much more difficult to have permanent rivalry games or to have any OOC games at all if that occurs.

In a four division alignment you'd have an even bigger problem of keeping the major rivalries a yearly occurrence.

Sorry for the long post, lol.
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